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How many here walked away from the left. I supported most of the social engineering projects from the 60s and 70s. I definitely supported women's rights and minority rights and still do. I even support affirmative action although I now think it was implemented so poorly it may have done more harm than good. There was a time when I would even listen patiently to Marxist idiocy.

I fall into a class that probably has more in common with the deep state than many people. My interests and theirs align on such things as cheap foreign imports, immigration, government spending, banksterism, globalism, the price of real estate, educational branding and in many other areas. It wasn't until Hillary Clinton was about to become president that I had to say my interests were not in the nation's interest.

I'm not a revolutionary by temperament but the social revolution the left is engaged in is not my biggest concern, their incompetence is. You cannot have a society based on emotions.

Did you walk away from the left?

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wolfhnd 8 June 6
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1

Actually, I was a libertarian when I was younger, and left it when I realized it's an ideology that would require shooting free-riders until none remained...and my fellow human find that idea repulsive in far larger numbers than agree to it. I test drove conservatism and classical liberalism, but conservatism doesn't conserve anything of value and classical liberalism leads directly to progressivism and to exactly what we enjoy today: collectivism.

I'm currently politically homeless. I'm beginning to think we really ought to unwind the general government and revert sovereignty back to the individual States. Maybe or maybe not then constitute a few sectional confederations. For now I'm pretty much a nationalist, but grudgingly so.

govols Level 8 Sep 21, 2020
0

When a man is in his 20's if he is not a liberal he has not a heart. If in his 40's and still a liberal he has not a brain. - Winston Churchill

2

I changed my mind completely back in the late ‘80s because of the old Fidonet CONTROV Echomail conference where political flame wars occurred daily. I learned from reading arguments over and over where I actually stood on issues. Before I even had Windows on my home computer, I wasn’t a democrat anymore. And I started studying real history. One side of the arguments was always all emotion, feelings, and devolved quickly to ad hominem attacks and name calling. The other side was calm, used facts, reason, statistics, and real history to make arguments. I realize today’s youngsters don’t want to read more than a short blurb or meme on which they form their political notions. Pity that. The nation is at risk.

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I was more of a moderate until 2008 and the attempt to recall Scott Walker in Wisconsin. The behavior of the left in those couple of years pushed me so far right, I don’t have one moderate bone in my body. What I’m not fire engine red conservative about I’m libertarian about, gay marriage for example.

ZyThum Level 4 June 6, 2020

I'm high in the personality trait openness which I suspect would be a common feature of people here as they feel compelled to discuss new ideas. How do you reconcile conservatism with openness?

@wolfhnd what do you mean by openness?

@Evidently

"Openness to experience is one of the domains which are used to describe human personality in the Five Factor Model. Openness involves six facets, or dimensions, including active imagination (fantasy), aesthetic sensitivity, attentiveness to inner feelings, preference for variety, and intellectual curiosity."

[en.m.wikipedia.org].

Personally I find psychology a lot like the way Steven Weinberg describes the usefulness of philosophers as a means to counter the bad ideas of other philosophers. That said the language and definition are useful. Also the highly sophisticated statistical practices used are the best we have to study behavior. I could probably adopt the language of the moral foundation as an alternative but it is even weaker from an empirical perspective.

Keep in mind that the facets are only general agreed on there is much argument over the theoretically foundation.

so your not a social conservative then????

@johnlondon

I know you read my posts so you know I don't believe in following your nature.

I'm in favor of social conservatism as long as it doesn't interfere with my scientific interests. For the most part it doesn't.

As I said in the opening statement I have become suspicious of social engineering. That doesn't mean that abandoning change for change's sake doesn't mean change is never needed.

We are a very diverse society that has always struggled with integration. Many issues that social conservatives find important I'm not really interested in and take a more libertarian opinion. For example instead of Gay marriage I preferred civil contracts getting the government out of the marriage business. That doesn't mean that the government doesn't have a right to ban incest or child marriage.

Hello wolfhnd. So, you like conserving good things and are open to changes meanwhile if the're good and gradual, no?

@wolfhnd I personally think most of that mambo jumbo is just that, jumbo jumbo. There is objective truth. There is scientific evidence. Curiosity is one of my biggest problems, and I get excited about beauty. My personal opinion is emotions are our biggest problems to deal with. Our own and those of others. Since I find emotions to be unbidden, and largely unwanted, I control my behavior. And ignore the emotions as much as possible. I’m open to truth, beauty, loving family relationships, and to hell with the emotional manipulations that abound in today’s society. Everyone has an excuse! 🙄. I’m old. Set in my ways. Learned a lot from experience. If someone tells me their truth is different from my truth, I usually tell them they have no sane concept of what truth is! I was once what you call open....no more.

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