"If your view of Julian Assange changed because of the nature of the material he was revealing as opposed to the methods used in gathering that material or the lives put in danger because of the release of that material, then you are a hack."
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Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.In an ideal world the press (MSM) would use the power of the first amendment to hold the government accountable for it's actions. Investigation of corruption and abuse of power, exposing unconstitutional acts and violating the oath of office these "public servants" have given lip service to is the vital purpose of the fourth estate. Recent events have exposed virtually all of the MSM as shills for far left globalist extremists. Or maybe they are multi-national corporatists or post-modern neo-marxists. Regardless of what they call themselves the media is no longer a watch dog, they are a lap dog of the left. That being the case, Wiki-Leaks and Julian Assange become essential if the people have any hope of finding out what their government is doing. The steady accumulation of power and acceptance of socialism is not accidental.
Hunterxx
Level 2
Apr 14, 2019
2
Yeah I like the idea of Wikileaks and think they've been a benefit in some ways. But it looks to me like they've also not held themselves to very high standards. Like the MSM, they can become their own monster.
I normally am a fan of Shapiro's reporting, but after watching 18 minutes of that video I am left with a disturbing feeling. He may be right and I think I agree that if Assange did help bypass security in government computers by breaking a password or trying to, that he should be held accountable for that. I can draw a line between journalism and hacking I think. And I can understand the complaint about not redacting needless information that can be harmful.
But the eagerness and almost joy and the one sided portrayal by Shapiro doesn't give me a good feeling. His claims that WikiLeaks is a Russian front without evidence and basing it on "the best intel" without explaining what that intel was, his refusal to acknowledge the clear service that WikiLeaks has provided to transparency around the world, and his focus on Assange being "the world's worst human" just made this sound like a mainstream hit piece.
At the very least, Shapiro's tone should have been measured and should have acknowledged the good that Assange has done and the importance of journalism and the risks to free speech and media reporting this situation presents. But he failed to do that.
For me, this poorly delivered bit by Shapiro was a real hit on his credibility.
WingedRyno
Level 6
Apr 13, 2019
1
I think those are valid criticisms. I've never liked generally how Shapiro will call people "bad," or call them "pieces of human debris." I think this is partly just a stylistic thing and is often done in jest, but I don't think it's the right thing to do, except when he's talking about, say, a school shooter or something.
I also agree he glossed over the "Russian cutout" comment too quickly. This might have been due to time constraints, but I think he should've prioritized explaining an accusation like that. I briefly researched it myself, and it does seem like this is something that is at least suspected by the intelligence community (see the link for an example: [google.com]. But I'd like to know more, personally, if I had time to research more.
All that said, I don't lose faith in Ben because I never thought he wasn't biased. I don't really trust anyone to give me all the fact or to be completely fair in their analysis... but I fully believe Ben is more upfront about his biases, and more willing to remain intellectually honest, than anyone else in news media, even if he's not perfect. I try to critically evaluate the things he says, but I respect him far more than any other pundit or journalist. I don't have to agree with him on everything.
I think?? it's a (Very) tangled web. Ben is 90% Trump and Trump is not pursuing his campaign promise about Hillary. Julian, again and again received info showing what she did. It seems Hillary is protected at Julian's expense. Then? You heard about Ecuador's 4 BILLION dollar 'gift'?? I welcome correction since I'm not as up as some here, thanks.
I think Julian Assange did a great job. Obama and his administration including the infamous Hilary Clinton and other world wide politics, are the real danger yet still free to continue their assaults. The luck of transparency in government's actions gave birth to Assanage.
Mindyou
Level 5
Apr 13, 2019
0
I'm developing my opinion on Assange, but right now I feel like he engaged in something that was generally good, but it seems he didn't hold himself to a high enough standard of conduct. I don't believe in compromising morality to achieve even the best of ends. With my limited knowledge, it seems Assange was either an immoral person from the beginning, or he compromised his morals as things progressed... it happens to a lot of people in business and politics.
@Shimrit what makes you think Wikileaks isn't corrupt and elitist?
(That's not a loaded question... I'd honestly like to know any reasons you might have to trust them.)
Do any of you actually know anything about his methodology in receiving the documents? I notice they keep saying he hacked it but you know, pretty damn sure he hasn't needed to hack shit in a long, long time. WHISTLEBLOWERS did the "HACKING", he published newsworthy material that had a public interest which, is a protected action, specifically for instances where proof of corruption at the highest level may only be come by questionable means, and must be made public for the good of The People...
Let me pose to you a hypothetical... Let's say, the free world, and the freedom of all it's people, is on the line, you know this. Now, the only way you can (possibly) save it, the only thing you can do, to try to save anyone, is to access your bosses computer, copy the files to a USB stick, and get it to a legitimately not corrupted news outlet, and let's say the only one of those you know of is Julian Assange..
What would you do?
And what consequence would you say you deserve, for being the founder of the chosen news outlet, and getting the information to the public...??
JohnWick89
Level 2
Apr 13, 2019
2
I was thinking the same thing. Can they prove he hacked or someone working for him hacked ? Ive had mixed feelings about him, not happy he released info and names of our assets in the middle east.
So much for the burden of proof!
@ulfhedna those are perfectly reasonable questions and, the devil's in the details, as they say.. I think it's encapsulated in the fact that our very President said Assanges work was "needed" and "correct". I can't understand how anyone would get all crazy about the hacking when what was being brought to light and exposed wouldn't have been by any other means.. we're talking about freedom here man, some things are work dying or killing for, let alone stealing. It's a selfless, and self sacrificing act, for anyone to commit espionage in the attempt to tell the public the truth their government is concealing from them.
I support such action, period.
@CrimsonFox
'The accused are guilty until proven innocent' - 'Law and Order, 2019'
Everybody here should see this:
And I rest my case your honors..
@JohnWick89 Sad, isn't it...
Julian's crime was giving the public proof of what has been speculated all along, the machinations of government are utterly crooked.
Some laws he broke seemingly are made to protect those entrusted with huge responsibility involved in criminal activity.
In any case, with all the dirt he released on Hillary Clinton, I though Mr. Trump may have shown him some leniency!
KK777
Level 4
Apr 12, 2019
2
Maybe by getting assange to the USA is to actually save his ass. Maybe he will finally give up the goods on Seth Rich ......maybe
@ulfhedna trust the plan
My view of Assange has never really changed
He was borderline criminal with Wikileaks, using at times very questionble methods to get his Leaks
And that Rape allegation? Me thinks there was something there because he ran & hid
Phrankhs
Level 7
Apr 12, 2019
3
That's a fair assessment. Though I think running and hiding even though you're innocent because you know you're a target is also a plausible scenario.
No one is addressing the issue of flip flopping.
jnaatjes
Level 7
Apr 12, 2019
0
what flip flop i would like to know more
Wouldn’t it made sense to allow the information to be released through an American outlet. Not saying he couldn’t done it in conjunction with an American outlet. The reason I say this is because I do really believe in transparency and the press’ right to hold our government accountable. I just would prefer US press release state secrets so as they can be held accountable by citizens of the US. This way hopefully a US outlet would use some kind of discretion in what is pertinent & what is only harmful to active soldiers.
@jnaatjes the bush administration used fear safety and security to take control of our rights to privacy. A great man once said that if you give up your freedom for safety and security you will have nor deserve nether and then the oboma administration came and showed us just why we can’t give up any rights or freedom to these ppl
I stood by Assange in 2010, and I still stand by him.
The fact that he "put Americans in harm’s way" is laughable.
How many times has the United States, who is supposed to protect it’s citizens, put them in harm’s.
9/11 and Bengazi are two incidents that immediately come to mind when the US Government had information and failed to act in the best interest of its people.
CrimsonFox
Level 4
Apr 12, 2019
6
Aren’t you just saying one wrong justifies another?
@Jride I suppose it could be Interpreted that way. Two wrongs don’t make a right. Both are wrong, but who is more wrong?
@Jride there are degrees of wrong?
A hierarchy of wrongdoing?
@Jride
the point is if someone steals a piece of paper to stop genocide, it's rediculous to send them to prison like someone stealing your car. We gotta use a bit of rationale and even police officers are allowed use of discretion as to whether or not to charge a person with a crime. If you hit a gun wielding woman to stop her from shooting up a cafe, think they'll take you in for assault and battery????
@JohnWick89 I actually agree with you there are degrees. Admittedly I’m not a expert on everything Mr. Assange has released. I do think he could be hauled to US and still be found not guilty if what he released didn’t harm soldiers in the field and he wasn’t acting out of malice against US with foreign interests. I do think he would have been better off releasing the information in concert with an American news outlet to help shield him from the foreign interests questions.
@JohnWick89 & @Jride
Was there a time when the mainstream press was behind Assange?
@CrimsonFox I would say the mainstream media was behind him right up-to the democratic national party emails.
You still have acne...professor!
arboristly560
Level 6
Apr 12, 2019
1
Good argument
The astablishment and its cronies can't survive in the light and Assange was exposing their lies and corruption by bringing it out for all to see, so they have to make him pay. I dought it will go to an open court or he will simply disappear.
Causeif
Level 2
Apr 12, 2019
3
Well, he did reveal corruption. You may call him a traitor or you may call him a hero.
MLACANA
Level 5
Apr 12, 2019
3
If one called him a traitor, whom was he traiting against? If revealing corruption is traiting, then I'd call him a hero!
He can uncover corruption and also do so in an unethical, dangerous way. Two things can be true at once, and I don't think the ends justify the means.
@jnaatjes He certainly got a few of Afghani translators, truck drivers, construction workers killed because he refused to redact their names despite of being warned by the US. Also hacking a site and stealing information is no different than someone breaking into your house and stealing your SS#, credit cards, birth certificates, homemade sex tape, grandmas black and white bushy nude photos then uploading them online for the whole world to see. His intentions "might have been good, huge might" but the results ended up getting a bunch of poor afghanis killed by Al Qaeda and Taliban.
@Scanderbeg amen. People need to stop ignoring the facts just because they like the bumper sticker version of Julian Assange. At low resolution, you might think he's a hero. But the Devil is in the details.
@jnaatjes That was such a Petersonian answer and i love it. The devil is indeed in the details. It will be interesting how this proceeds from here and how many people are going to revert back and forth between calling him a hero and criminal.
Everything will eventually be revealed. From the housetops! Every idle word will be judged, too. Personally, I like transparency.
dmatic
Level 8
Apr 12, 2019
3
Me too... I just don't like hacking government computers and releasing information on private citizens.
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