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LINK Is the 'Intellectual Dark Web' Politically Diverse [enough]?

Uri Harris @Quillette recently penned an interesting article [quillette.com] in which he claims that there is disconnect between the core IDW members’ policy positions (majority liberal, see [danielmiessler.com] and what he sees as biased attacks on Democrats. He cites the dual evidence of the willingness of IDW members to talk with conservatives and his perception of a conservative leaning of the fans of the IDW members.

I believe what the author is missing is that the Democratic party has fractured and that its far-Left, identity-politics, callout culture wing has taken over the narrative. To me, the IDW represents an honest, common-sense group of people who are willing to openly discuss the merits of opinions based on facts, reason and compassion.

According to the author, “The IDW needs to make a choice. Does it want to be a partisan organisation, where its members get together in front of an audience to iron out their differences and strategise on how to defeat the new left, or does it want to be genuinely non-partisan? If the latter, it needs to open itself up to new left people and ideas.”

I wrote a bit about this in the newsletter [slug.com] and just two days ago here: "A potential measure for thought diversity"

We are at a great time to discuss the movement and how to proceed. Some things we could do (or not):

  • Make the political positions of key IDW members more clear to better show its diversity.

  • Come up with a message that is tailored to the concerns and perceptions of those on the far-Left.

  • Actively seek out and promote far-Left spokespeople who bring honesty, civility, reason and compassion. (suggestions?)

What do you think?

Admin 8 Apr 17
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32 comments (26 - 32)

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1

I believe it is.

1

There is not biased attacks against Liberals, there is decidedly attacks against identitarians who hold fascist views. Morons like AOC who hold they should be allowed to bulldoze houses because gov't workers can remake them to a higher standard. Those people get mocked, those people that never had to fix a DMV mistake.

What the hell does the DMV have to do with public housing projects?

The inefficiency of the DMV is by no means insurmountable either. Sometimes I wonder if Conservatives consciously make public services shit so that people want to get rid of them.

@InternetDorkWeb DMV is how the gov't will handle every problem.

@Penrodster And what about countries like the UK? I mean, we have our own version of the DMV but aside from your driving test, paying your road tax and changing your address on your license there is very little interaction with them. And all of the above (except the test) is done online... so is the UK magical. or is your attitude to the public sector a bit exaggerated?

@InternetDorkWeb When there is an actual problem that requires an effort, I am assuming all DMVs function the same. Here, if you make enough that everything can be handled through the car dealer, it goes easy (someone else deals with it) otherwise it can be a nightmare.

@EdNason Thanks, I use the DMV to spitball healthcare thoughts. Socialized medicine doesn't work where you have some problem. The bureaucracy bogs down with different or complication but it does do mundane, same every time well. Could it handle something like vaccines? Would that be smoother?

@EdNason Yeah, I think their wait period is how the socialized countries handle rationing. There's a longer wait on the treatments that go to older people too, cost savings from that expenditure falloff.
Socialized medicine can work if you're willing to leave windows open in the winter for pstients with pneumonia.

@EdNason But I have used national healthcare, and it’s nothing like the DMV you have described. The analogy is lazy, and completely senseless in the context of healthcare.

@InternetDorkWeb I'll cop to lazy and fat. Our health care has degraded precipitously in care and cost over the last decade due to ACA. In Canada the problems I described are being fixed by adding doctor offices that work on cash, us too btw. If there was no problem the cash option wouldn't come up.

1

The article linked is not only false, but dramaticaly false. He states:

>>if it’s true that the IDW members, with the exception of Shapiro, align almost entirely with liberals on the main issues that divide liberals and conservatives, then we should reasonably expect them in practice to align politically with liberals and not conservatives.

Which basically misses the entire point of the IDW. The IDW is almost exclusively built by people who are:
a) Against censuring of political views.
b) Against demonizing political views.
c) In favor of long format, well thought out, political discussions.

The current left (ie progressives not conservatives) is against each of these things. So the actual formula is:

The IDW is (largely) against conservatives in their theory, but against progrssives in their actions. IOW the disconnect between these two is precisely the point of the IDW.
Take Jonathon Haidt as the premier example. He was raised progressive, but broke from the orthodoxy when he said, basically, "Hey, wait a minute, there are these five elements of morality and progressives can't even see three of them!"
That is an attack on progressivism... from someone who still believes progressive theory, but is against progressive action.
An IDW, for example, will be against conservatives shouting down a progressive speaker, and just as against progressives shouting down a conservative speaker. Not only does that give him far, far more work to do in the later category, it is a violation of a basic progressive principle: conservatives must be shouted down.

Note, for example, the irony in this mention:
>>. This is what popular new right YouTube channels like Sargon of Akkad have been doing for years: scanning the news every day for examples that confirm this worldview and presenting them with outrage.

That would be the Sargon... who was banned! He makes it seem as if this 'outrage' and 'worldview' needs to be ginned up with anecdotal examples... all the while providing a classic example. One where the IDW (read Peterson) rightly objected to Sargon being banned!!

Here is another example of his fundamental misunderstanding of the issues:

>> When a prominent IDW figure dismisses white privilege as a “Marxist lie,” which Peterson did in a speech in late 2017, it’s really hard to have good faith discussions on such issues.

He ignores the question of... what if it is a Marxist lie?
IOW are we only to be allowed to be 'political diverse' if we are required to fail to actually speak the truth?

@VonO Someone took issue with Uri's use of that example (JBP saying white privilege is a Marxist lie), I think on Twitter - if not on the response to the article on Quillette, where there's a pretty great discussion. (In other of Uri's papers, from 2017 or 18, he quoted one of the comments on his last article, ha.) I may be misremembering but I think Uri responded with a semi-concession.

1

Wouldn't any of those steps risk media and campus tour sponsorships?

How so?

0

Can I have an example of a far-left spokesperson who demonstrates honesty, civility, reason and compassion and cite instances in which they have done so for each category? The leftists who have demonstrated these qualities have been attacked by the far left. My examples are Joe Rogan, Eric Weinstein, Brett Weinstein, Steven Pinker, Stephen Frye, Jordan Peterson, Sam Harris, Dave Rubin and Ricky Gervais.

0

Thisis as near to an unrestricted open forum as we can reasonably get, if you want to impose virtue signaling diversity on us , you're better off looking elsewhere,

0

I believe no one should be senored if the initiation of the person is not to harm, silence, threat, demean, belittle, hurt, degrade, sell or otherwise themselves or the other person or there for.
Freedom of speech in today's society is better then Gold or anything we know. Many are silenced by there government and need to opportunity to tell the truth no? As far as far right "conspiracy theories" many have been proven true and these people have a right to speak as well right? As far as far left people they have a right to speak as right as well no? As long as the guide line is set as absult no harm ever i see no problem with keeping the FREE SPEECH plate form was that not the intention? We all have free choice to avoid or respond self responsibility is a must as well no?

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