It's a good start, but in order to try to fix the problem, we would need a deeper understanding of it.

@A1fredo why do you think it goes deeper than that ? the self preservation instinct makes selfishness sound good and the teachings from every institution reinforces the fulfillment of that instinct. what else is there ?

@solopro Beyond instinct (reptilian brain,) there's emotions (limbic system,) and cognition (neocortex.) Plus, it's a discipline that needs to be worked on voluntarily, therefore requires a motivational understanding of why it would be a better choice to work on it, and the proper techniques to do so, for starters.

@A1fredo look around... people aren't interested in discipline of any sort, why would people control themselves when they don't have to ?

@solopro That's why I said that it requires a motivational understanding of why it would be better to work on it. You and I know that it would be better for all to stop the nonsense. If they got it too, they would have a reason to work on it. Plus, there's an incredible amount of reasons to do so beyond the economics and politics of it, like the personal satisfaction (which includes happiness--I would argue most are motivated by their emotional dissatisfaction.)

@A1fredo thats an unreliable motivation. a "sense" of satisfaction always loses to a full belly if you value a full belly. you will never be able to convince someone to put others first. empathy and putting others first aren't just choices, they are expressions of your character.

@solopro Well, yes, it sure is. You cannot make sure you get your way all the time. That's not how it works unless you want to go authoritarian. And no, it does not lose to a full belly at all. Children would starve to death if their mothers preferred a full belly. That's another good point, the appreciation of emotional satisfaction is something that has been replaced by the constant availability of technological escapes to problems in contemporary society. Emotions does not work like the body does. It takes a little lag, and we have become to desperate to wait for it. However, the emptiness inside, the emotional pain cannot be avoided in the end, the one that comes from a lifetime of emotional negligence towards yourself. And that is the problem. Satisfaction would not be the motivator. The motivation would be to stop the pain. Just like Peterson once said¿ they asked a cancer survivor who had been through depression too: if you had to get cancer again, or depression again, which one would you choose: cancer. The motivation is to stop the emotional fuel, the pain that compells them to destroy. You think they wouldn't want to rather live happy productive lives? They would, but the emotional pain won't let them. This could offer a way out.

@A1fredo if you really believe that then it sounds like you found your hook, now you just need to bridge the gap and figure out how to apply the principle practically. good luck to you !

@solopro See? You think it's just that easy, don't you? Yeah, let's give NASA a couple of matches and some gas, see if they can reach the moon. What was the whole point of your questions if you were going to act dismissive when answered to you? If you had a reason not to believe me, you would have an argument against what I'm saying. You choosing not to believe me, well, that's negligence.

@A1fredo dude relax. I know when I'm just spinning my wheels. we are just going around in circles.i suggest a thing can't be done and you say it needs to be done, so I say ok then try to do it and you say its too hard. I'm not dismissing you, im just getting off the carousel.

@solopro Yeah, that is a problem because the thing is that I cannot do it on my own, I need the input of other people -to say the least.- I don't get funding, I can't do paid research, I can't promote whatever it is that could be of help, etc. I am one poor man who lives in México, so my capabilities are extremely limited. So if you went "Well, that seems interesting. Count with me whenever you need help, like maybe getting the perspective from somebody other than yourself to take into consideration," then it wouldn't be a carousel. But when you say "Oh haha Well, Good luck with that" and go away. Well, that leaves me back in square one and can never ever get anywhere so the idea dies with me. See? I can't get help from Academia, nor the Government, all I got is people. And everyone reacts the same way. I keep trying and getting the same response. You must understand it's not easy. So forgive me if I can't just relax. Plus, I wouldn't want to just relax and wait for the world to burn. I would think that's something to be appreciated, especially if it's something beneficial to us all. But I would be wrong, wouldn't I.

@A1fredo my goodness the irony. you want people to act more like a collective, but in order to pioneer the change, you must rely on your individuality... amazing.

@solopro No, I don't want anybody anything. If things could be as I wanted, I would be filthy rich and fuck off to Neverland and never talk to a human again. Do you think I like talking to people? Ever read my posts? I don't! But I have to be realistic. I need others because I'm a poor piece of shit, and I don't have the means to spread any messages. So I see you all running around like retards unaware about our own nature, so I thought we could work together. But yeah, fuck it. All of us, fuck, deep up our assholes. Shitloads of cum. Whatever. Let's get it all burned down. The fuck do I care, it's not like I will survive that long. Whatever. Fuck it. Forget it.