Lately people who've deemed me atheist sought me out for debate more frequently.

RichardD comments on May 26, 2019:

But physics doesn't tell you how to behave.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@WishIKnew Physics also tells you how electrons and tungsten work together to illuminate a room, but it doesn't tell you who flipped the switch.

Lately people who've deemed me atheist sought me out for debate more frequently.

R_D_Russell comments on May 26, 2019:

How do you explain then how the Bible is deliberately self-contradictory, if its utility can be reduced to nothing more than a means of subverting humanity? Example: The book of Job, Ecclesiastes, Lamentations, Jonah, and all critique religion most pointedly, and are honest about doubt and if there...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

I would like to recommend to you this book, I think you will find the titular essay quite engaging. "The Power Tactics of Jesus Christ and Other Essays" by Jay Haley. You can get it used on Amazon for a couple of bucks. I tried to find a PDF version but didn't see one. Looks like public libraries might have an online (or physical) copy. (A couple of reviews that I found online:) #1 In this classic volume available once again, it is the title essay that is the most controversial. Jay Haley proposes an original interpretation of the Bible analyzing Jesus' actions as a man trying to build a mass movement to topple a power structure. Using wit and wry humor, Haley instructs the reader in the other essays on what it takes to be schizophrenic, as well as the art and technique required to have an awful marriage, and how to be an awful therapist. His rationale for a directive therapy is the subject of other essays. #2 Although the title essay is one of the-longer ones and quite serious in tone (dealing with Christ's basic innovation--""the idea of striking for power by organizing the poor and the power-less"") it is not really representative of the pieces here. There are six in all, five of which deal with various aspects of psychotherapy--Mr. Haley is the.director of a child guidance center and has done considerable research and writing in the field. And three of the five, ""The Art of Psychoanalysis,"" ""The Art of Being a Failure as a Therapist,"" and ""The Art of Being a Schizophrenic"" combine some diverting ploys of the art of upmanship in lying-downmanship. The last. one on the schizophrenic (is he really?) holy, terror, who sprouts initially at home to really blossom in a mental hospital where the ward psychiatrist is as unavailable as his father ever was, is the best of the lot. One assuasive essay on the amiable hippies and one more serious if harder to retain discussion of Whither Family Therapy. . . . The final impression--a genuinely funny spoof of shrink think.

Ok Powerful Men Tend to be Over Sexed?

JobyOneKenobi comments on May 26, 2019:

Aren't there female versions of horn dogs?

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

"Fuck Buddies"

BooRadley has been banned from her own groups?

SpikeTalon comments on May 16, 2019:

It's my understanding the ban is about two days. I only have one side of the story here. If you know someone lost their temper there, then you already answered your own question in regards to the reason why for the ban...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@Gerri4321 No worries.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

SpikeTalon comments on May 20, 2019:

You did the right thing, she brought too much drama to the sight, and had mentioned to me about leaving from here anyway. Some folks take things too far. I messaged you by the way.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@SpikeTalon I'm not 'keeping complaining', I just haven't been around in a couple of weeks and am catching up on the happenings and doings.

Assembly of Elders eh?

Admin comments on May 12, 2019:

Yeah, do older people naturally become wary of change? I think there are more good things to conserve now than ever before!

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@iThink Spot on. And guilty as charged ;-)

BooRadley has been banned from her own groups?

SpikeTalon comments on May 16, 2019:

It's my understanding the ban is about two days. I only have one side of the story here. If you know someone lost their temper there, then you already answered your own question in regards to the reason why for the ban...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@Gerri4321 The hooks for bias are there in the rules. I noted them myself when I joined.

@ADMIN have you read all the post that are in all the groups made by the a hole who attacked Boo?

Garsco comments on May 18, 2019:

Most of what I've read on IDW I have no issue with but sometimes some can really *trigger* others (sorry). I enjoy Boo, AZWoman and others' posts and appreciate what they say. The provoker that is common to all this *is* rather annoying and frankly I often find him kind of boring. Perhaps everyone...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

Me too. I liked Boo.

What is the deal with WilyRickWiles?

SpikeTalon comments on May 18, 2019:

Don't know myself about your first question there, as I never got his side of the story. What's wrong with the groups? Probably some more glitches is all.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

Wow. I must have missed a lot. Remind me to stock up on popcorn.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

EdNason comments on May 20, 2019:

do not get involved, simple as that. Stay out of it. Hurt feelings are ok... obviously no threats of violence. Perhaps close down the post, for a period of time to cool people off. Let it get ugly, (no threats) it will work itself out. If the free speech rights of even the most aggressive ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@Chicago, @chuckpo I do think that aggression should be moderated. As long as people are staying in their lanes and not tossing ad-homs, it's fair game, IMO.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

EdNason comments on May 20, 2019:

do not get involved, simple as that. Stay out of it. Hurt feelings are ok... obviously no threats of violence. Perhaps close down the post, for a period of time to cool people off. Let it get ugly, (no threats) it will work itself out. If the free speech rights of even the most aggressive ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@chuckpo, @Chicago Perfect response. I hadn't even thought about that, but I agree totally.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

EdNason comments on May 20, 2019:

do not get involved, simple as that. Stay out of it. Hurt feelings are ok... obviously no threats of violence. Perhaps close down the post, for a period of time to cool people off. Let it get ugly, (no threats) it will work itself out. If the free speech rights of even the most aggressive ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@chuckpo We've upped our standards, now up yours! ;-)

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

EdNason comments on May 20, 2019:

do not get involved, simple as that. Stay out of it. Hurt feelings are ok... obviously no threats of violence. Perhaps close down the post, for a period of time to cool people off. Let it get ugly, (no threats) it will work itself out. If the free speech rights of even the most aggressive ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

I'm all for the marketplace of ideas. Duke it out until the sacred cows come home, but end it quickly when it gets aggressive-- I agree.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

iThink comments on May 20, 2019:

I imagine your job is a bit like trying to herd cats. As IDW grows there will no doubt be more "drama" to come. Establishing a policy and a method in how best to "manage squabbles" is definitely in order. So far I have no personal complaints worthy of your attention or concern. I'm a big boy and ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@Gerri4321 IZ think things should end when the ad-homs come out. The discussion is generally devolving rapidly at that point. Maybe other users can carry it forward, but the user(s) involved should be given a time-out (IMO) for engaging in that type of behavior. Maybe a friendly warning or two first would be nice to let them know they're getting to aggressive.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

Admin comments on May 20, 2019:

Thanks for the feedback so far. I really hate to micromanage things and to remove posts/members. Here's an example of one today where someone tries to post related posts in all the IDW groups (in this case, anti-abortion messages but the content is not the issue). We have the choice of sending ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@Admin I don't know how your posts are organized under the hood. Why not permit, as a site feature, the ability to cross-post to multiple groups but have it be the *same* post in all of the groups *unless* a moderator objects. And then the moderator can choose to ( A ) disallow the post-- it is removed from the group; or ( B ) permit the post as a *copy* (new post) which then only the members of that group can comment on. If the moderator of a group does not choose one or the other, then *everybody* in *all groups* it is cross-posted to can comment and discuss the post. Then finally, perhaps give the moderator the right to 'discontinue' a post (which has gone off the rails, out-of-control, unwanted for whatever reason) which would stop further responses to that post from appearing in the moderator's group. The post would be closed with a link to the main (original) post (of last resort) where anybody interested could go and continue the conversation, outside of any group if need be. This idea may not be fully-formed and need some additional thought and fleshing out, but just as a first-run at a new / different way of posting, moderating and dealing with problem posts / users.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

SpikeTalon comments on May 20, 2019:

You did the right thing, she brought too much drama to the sight, and had mentioned to me about leaving from here anyway. Some folks take things too far. I messaged you by the way.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@SpikeTalon, @chuckpo Or even just a time-out. Either on a group-basis or a site-basis.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

SpikeTalon comments on May 20, 2019:

You did the right thing, she brought too much drama to the sight, and had mentioned to me about leaving from here anyway. Some folks take things too far. I messaged you by the way.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@SpikeTalon It sounds like you're describing poor coping behavior rather than being a bad user. Not everybody has the same presence of mind or ability to disengage when things heat up.

Just wanted to let you know that we did remove BooRadley from the site - perhaps too quickly.

chuckpo comments on May 20, 2019:

I think an actual conversation would have probably led to a better outcome. I think the punishment was uneven and maybe even confusing, and it wasn't exlplained at all. I'm getting it all 3rd-hand, so I'm doing my best. I think a reasonable conversation at quite a number of points leading up to the ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

I didn't see any of the actual exchange but I know who BooRadley is (was) and she didn't generally seem to be a bad user. I can't comment on whatever it was that happened. But I would like to remind you (Chuckpo) and anybody else of a couple of conversations we had awhile back regarding a method of filtering whereby people could self-select what they wanted to see / not see. As well as the community-- meaning the moderators of a group, or of the site-- could impose filters as well. That way there is more self-selecting / community(-standards)-selection and less actual out-and-out censorship of users / posts. That said, I do agree that there are probably posts which should be removed for the sake of decency and decorum. And of course anything which is actually illegal.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

acadian comments on Apr 10, 2019:

Aside from those Muslims who are overly anxious to get to the virgins in heaven, the peoples of the world seem to tolerate and even appreciate each other more than at any other time in history. I believe this is due to more traveling, and worldwide traveling at an earlier age. Also working and ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@acadian >> How do we prevent being conquered from within? Shoot professional lobbyists on sight. Divorce money from political influence. And shut the damn gates.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@parsifal If you want "whole cities for the taking" go talk to China, they seem to have a small stockpile of cities in need of both a point and a populace.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

parsifal comments on May 26, 2019:

what's next? a new dark ages. the apex has been reached and we are descending, doomed by our own moral posturing and political correctness.

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

Interesting comment, and quite possibly right. However, as a counterpoint, I would consider that a great deal of the Western world seems to be in the midst of drop-kicking "political correctness" into next Tuesday, as Conservatives and Nationalist-Populists are winning elections in country after country-- and beating back the Globalists in the process. As an aside, I don't know if "Globalism" is actually so terribly wrong as a concept, but rather wrong simply as it was set up and structured to benefit only the wealthiest elite. Certainly one of the key items to cherish and maintain (IMO) even in a "Globalist" society (I put it in quotes to separate it from the more common meaning) is the national history, culture and identity of the various regions. I think that with the advent of Industrialism and the Information Age, some sort of "Globalism" is essentially a foregone conclusion and that the real thing people are rebelling against is the stripping away of culture and chafing under the increasingly authoritarian (totalitarian-wanna-be's) government structures which are getting hoisted into place-- and particularly with provisions to silence and restrict the rights / abilities of the public to resist or do anything about it. One thing the Globalists (no quotes) overlooked is the power of the Internet and the ability for people to compare notes these days. Freedom, Freedom of Speech and Expression and Freedom of Association are hard-won rights-- and something that we should be thinking about on this Memorial Day too. They should be jealously guarded and defended.

Under New Management Well, apparently somebody died and made me the boss. Ain't that special?

Gerri4321 comments on May 26, 2019:

@jwhitten in reality how is IQ to be determined anyway? If you know a lot about how shoes are made and I know a lot about how great shoes are better for walking doesn't our knowledge compliant eachother? 🤔 Congrats are in order I do believe! 🤓

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

I think that would make us sole brothers...

Under New Management Well, apparently somebody died and made me the boss. Ain't that special?

Varga comments on May 26, 2019:

Well, being that I follow you and I like the way you’ve carried your self, I joined this group! For better or worse Congratulations!

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

Hmm... The last time someone said that to me they were propping me up to slip a ring on my finger. Then they shoved a cake in my mouth. Things haven't been the same since.

Under New Management Well, apparently somebody died and made me the boss. Ain't that special?

Garsco comments on May 26, 2019:

About a week after I joined IDW, I was bestowed moderator status on a medical-like group because I was next in line as the next longest member (go figure!). I have overcome a couple of significant health issues and have learned a great deal about those issues in the past few years and alternatives ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

LOL! Anybody gets outta line in here'll get belted and suspendered!! Thanks for the kind words. I can sympathize with you on the medical issues. You seem to have made it through though with your spirits intact, so that's a good thing. When stuff gets heavy it's all too easy to get caught up in the "maybe's" and "what if's" and lose sight of the fact that the goal is to be living and not dying. The other complicating factors that often accompany 'significant health issues' don't help things either. "Let us be JOYFUL in the face of that which troubles us. Let us celebrate life and living even as we contemplate the alternatives." -- Me. (I have heard it said that it's the pinnacle of narcissism to quote one's self. On the other hand, it's infinitely easier and they rarely sue for unpaid royalties later) :-)

Under New Management Well, apparently somebody died and made me the boss. Ain't that special?

chuckpo comments on May 26, 2019:

We lost several core members to a troll incident--they died on the free speech hill. You got the site because you were the next longest member--PROBABLY. Maybe this one's different. That's how I got someone else's group. I thought the group's premise was strange too. Mean 100, standard deviation of ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

Yes, that's what the Admin said, that I was the next most senior member. I'm not really sure how to take that, since at Walmart they call those people "Greeters". >> Mean 100, standard deviation of 15. Two standard deviations out would be 130 Ask not for whom the bell tolls, the bell curve tolls for thee! ;-) >> The math supplies exactly NO MEANING Interesting that you should phrase it thus two sentences after your Jordan Peterson reference... I've been looking forward to getting it and reading it-- "Maps of Meaning". Though it isn't much about math. I think IQ tests do impart meaning, but only in the sense of "raw talent", so to speak. It's up to the individual to make something of it. And high intellect alone isn't a sure-fire predictor of absolute success. Though I reckon it is often a contributing factor. JBP seems to lean more towards "conscientiousness" as the best predictor.

Does 000 count? Just kidding!! Looking to have meaningful and substantive conversations

chuckpo comments on Apr 9, 2019:

Ummm, Koko the Gorilla had an IQ of 95. I wasn't sure if the group name was a joke? Mean 100, sd 15? If it is a joke, what kinds of conversations are happening? If it's not a joke, maybe you want to pick something at or near 2 standard deviations? I wasn't sure what the group is supposed to be. I ...

jwhitten replies on May 27, 2019:

@chuckpo You say "intelligence" and yet you talk about "society". I think that there is likely quite a bit more to "sociability" than simply some measure of "intelligence". It's been my observation that sometimes people who seem highly intelligent have a hard time connecting to other people in a kind of "social impedance-mismatch" issue. The things they find interesting to talk might come across as exotic or esoteric relative to a typical person's knowledge or experience and they either don't know how to (or don't care to) "downshift" their mindset / subject selection to more mundane, run-of-the-mill topics. And then more to your point, whenever someone talks about IQ as being the ultimate sorting guide, you might want to point them toward the "Flynn Effect" and ask them how something so allegedly inalienable can wind up being so mutable...

[tvline.com] Will this be attacked for not including trans?

jwhitten comments on May 3, 2019:

The various pageants have already been twisted into pretzels by people with political agendas. Why should this one be any different?

jwhitten replies on May 19, 2019:

@An_Ominous Most likely due to the overwhelming dearth of eligible entrants...

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 17, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles I think we're facing a new situation for humanity where our ability to produce and distribute is rapidly outpacing our need for actual workers to go and do the work. Such that we're starting to see an increasing accumulation of people worldwide who aren't actively engaged in doing much-- or maybe even anything. Which is leading to a brand new type of employment problem, people who could work but just don't want to. The problem is that in our organizational paradigm these people would be called 'lazy', 'goldbrickers', 'freeloaders' and 'malingerers'. And in the old scheme these workers would be missed. Production would suffer for lack of workers. In the new paradigm they're not even missed. I was listening to an Eric Weinstein discussion where he was talking about that problem, and I completely agree. But it leads to the problem that I'm all the time going on about-- what is the value of money when nobody has any? How do people live? Eat? Get gas? Acquire things? And have a place to put them? Consider this-- if there was no limit on your ambition, where would you choose to live? Money is no object, pre-existing residents notwithstanding-- the sky is the limit. Where would it be? How big would your house be? How much stuff would you have? What kind of stuff would it be? What kind of car would you drive? Would you have your own airplane? If so, where would you keep it? What about your hobbies? Would you have "one of everything" to play with, "just in case"? What foods would you eat? Would you stuff yourself silly at every meal? Would you eat your vegetables? Here's another question. HOW would you get stuff? Would you go shopping? What would you expect to buy there? Would it be automated or staffed with sales-droids or people? Why would people bother going to work to serve you? Would they do it because they're bored? What would their motivation and/or incentive be? Why would people do dirty or dangerous jobs? Why would a plumber, for instance, come to your house and muck shit for nothing? How does a post-scarcity economy work? What happens if you get sick? What happens if you get bored? Who heals you? Who entertains you? And what do YOU do in all of this? Just lay around? Fiddle with your hobbies? Go chip in at a charity or something? This is the world we're rapidly approaching and I don't think that there are many answers yet. As we morph from gathering and hoarding to a service and distribution-based organization. Amazon may be the only company standing when it's over. I know Idiocracy predicted it would be CostCo but hey-- so they got one detail wrong. The rest seems pretty reasonable. We devolve into being extremely petty, immature, and emotionally stunted people-- because who would really want to put up with the likes of any ...

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@george George, I'll be honest. I'm not quite sure whether you're arguing *for* or *against* Socialism, or 'Democratic Socialism' as your comment seems to be a bit of both. Seemingly PRO: >> there is successful deomocratic socialism going on every day in many countries, the USA being the most prominent. Democratic socialism is happening in Europe as well. The "socialist" of today is not pushing for authoritarian take over of the economy or anything like was done in the USSR or anywhere else. Democratic socialism is a mixed economy with capitalism as the system but regulations and safe guards provided by the government. Seemingly CON: >> The tax breaks for corporations is socialism at its finest and people supporting the likes of Bernie Sanders think the socialism part should benefit ALL of us instead of just redistribution of wealth from the bottom to the top. Our socialist programs in America serve Wall Street and the military industrial complex across the board and the ones making the money use the media they own to attack anything that helps working people as being socialist and horrible while they are living it up thanks to socialism. I will say that I am not completely against any "Social" programs or "Social Responsibility" / aka "The Social Safety Net". I see the pros and cons of Capitalism, and even the pros of Socialism for what it's worth. The *idea* of Socialism is not horrible, just the *practical application* of it. I wrote more in my response to @WilyRickWiles where I pointed out that Capitalism tends to privatize the rewards and socialize the liabilities. That really is not fair. I don't personally have a problem with billionaires, but I do think that our system has become unbalanced and the people who have a considerable amount of "risk" involvement-- such as the surrounding community should share a lot more in the potential rewards. Thus government and private enterprise can operate cooperatively as arms-length partners and share together the ups and downs of the business venture. I am concerned about how Capitalism fits into and supports communities and vice versa.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@george I think that goes all ways-- all groups and in all directions. And not just religious groups either. I think it's pretty universal.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MADcHATTER comments on May 15, 2019:

For such a quorum is there a test to pass or metric we must demonstrate to attend? Or is just the claim of possessing such intellect sufficient? Shall we provide documentation of past varying IQ tests passed or perform feats of mnemonic legerdemain to delight the senses and influence the crowd?

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MADcHATTER LOL. You're good. That almost made sense! ;-)

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MADcHATTER comments on May 15, 2019:

I used to believe that Human Kind was evolving into a more enlightened species. Mired in its own technological advances and striving to do and become more as rapidly as possible. But the last couple of decades has shown me that simply is not the case. Intellectually many are devolving or, more ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MADcHATTER >> I fail to see how when they arent using Common Sense, knowledge, wisdom, critical thinking or any of the others mentioned. They are using Feelings, victimhood, hyperbole, fear, threats and blind ignorance to cowtow the many menial minds they seek to control through them. I think it comes down to perception-- which do you see? Tanks with people driving them, or the people driving tanks being controlled by someone somewhere else. That is a simplification, but the point that I was making is that the people you see in government, in large part, are simply the lackeys and puppets-- the "useful idiots"-- for more powerful people behind the scenes. You think Pelosi pulls her own strings? Or Biden? And it is those unseen puppeteers who become the masters of The State as they take control of the machinery of "The State". >> They are using Feelings, victimhood, hyperbole, fear, threats and blind ignorance to cowtow the many menial minds they seek to control through them. Of course they are. That's how they manipulate the Merry Band of Fools. But *they themselves* are using reason, rationale and cunning to make those moves and pull the strings.The people coming at us with "Muh Feelings" are simply information-age cannonballs being fired like scattershot. *WE* are making a mistake by engaging with them. While certainly you have to duck the bullets, I submit-- which is the better objective, standing there dodging cannonballs or working more concertedly to shut down the cannons? >> When referencing the State I am not doing it as a static place or thing. My parlance is to reference the very people who run it. Wall Street, Big Pharma, Military Industrial complex We **completely** agree. UPDATE- With the one proviso that the 'old guard' is busy being supplanted in large part by the 'new guard' comprised of the techno-elites. There's still plenty of pie to go around, but it's the new kids who are working on taking the lion's share for themselves. >> Accept the new paradigm or lose our perceived personage? Wrong...accept it and you DO lose your personal personage. You become nothing more than a NPC. A cog in the machine. I think you misunderstood me, I wasn't advocating that you should want that. Only saying that's what's being pushed down as our new station. I was advocating for the 'new platform' from which to develop a new power structure capable of pushing back. >> watching a Disney nature film in school about lemmings jumping off the cliff, tumbling down the rock face to the last cliff then jumping into the ocean and swiming out to sea...all of them drowning. Probably the David Attenborough film? There is quite a bit of controversy surrounding that film as other experts indicate that lemmings are somewhat hard to film because they are...

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

Babou comments on May 12, 2019:

I doubt very much if the founding fathers were thinking about individuals rather than nations when they spoke of “enemies of the United States.” Think of all the war victims of the US from good wars to bad wars, from Hiroshima kids in WWII to landmine injured Cambodians, to blown-up Iraqi ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@Babou >> I think Benedict Arnold and John Andre (who actually was hanged) would have been considered spies and agents of a foreign power (nation-state). Yes, that's a good point. I concede that one ;-) >> If a nation-state causes terror deliberately and directly, especially if it us (as in carpet bombing Berlin or Dresden) we say it’s to cause the civilian population to be “demoralized” and “sap their will” to do something. Make clarinets or china or whatever they were doing in Dresden. We do not admit that we’re trying to “terrify” them. While killing them. Is your hypocrisy sense tingling? Yup. And I agree with you there too. >> You say you see a huge difference between dressing the wounds of non-combatants, and giving them communications gear. Yes, because in the one instance you are working immediately to save the life of a human being on a decision-needed-right-now sort of basis. In the second instance you are simply handing them a means to communicate, and apart from the contrived example of calling someone to stop the counter on the rogue-nuke-- there is no emergency, and in fact, given the fact that they are a sworn enemy the assumption should be that they would call someone to *start* that counter instead. There is no emergency of life-threatening proportion in the second instance. Also I just noticed your example was for "non-combatants". I was considering caring for enemy combatants, which is standard US policy when they have been captured or found wounded on the battlefield. At least modern policy anyway. The Geneva Convention and all of that. In any case, it is not up to me to decide in the case of Hamas-- despite what other interactions the US may have with them. As a citizen of the United States it is my duty to uphold (adhere to) the laws of the United States. And one of them states that it is treason to give aid and comfort to US enemies and Hamas is a declared US enemy. While we're on the subject, one might also speculate why John Kerry hasn't been charged in violation of the Logan Act which states that private citizens are not permitted to engage in negotiations with nations having a dispute with the US. *The Logan Act (1 Stat. 613, 18 U.S.C. § 953, enacted January 30, 1799) is a United States federal law that criminalizes negotiation by unauthorized persons with foreign governments having a dispute with the United States.* >> You can dress wounds of non-combatants? How good of you. How about preventing them in the first place? If you called Hiroshima 15 minutes before the Bomb hit, and warned them to take shelter (and they believed you) would have been treason? Yes, technically I think it is-- but morally, I'm not sure how to call that one. I understand the "many versus the one" arguments. Also, as ...

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

TommyB comments on May 12, 2019:

"Local or Federal: Best Way to Fix Americas Ills Group" I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiment, and i may be completely off base here 'cause i'm not a lawyer, but the one thing i see that could prevent this so far, is the fact that the Constitution ALSO forbids gov't interference into ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@TommyB Okay, final thought - one party turning a blind eye and not getting caught / called-out for it, doesn't make it right or legal for anybody else to do it. However, this horse is getting quite close to D.E.D.... ;-)

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@EliCaesar, @MickeyRat >> "If god meant man to fly, he would have given us wings." He did give us wings. You just have to use your imagination to see them.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MickeyRat, @EliCaesar >>Give me an A.I. that beats the champ in a calculation game but can also beat someone in say Monopoly or paint with a paint brush free hand .... In due time. You did not spring forth fully-formed and ready to do any of those things and you are the culmination of all life on this planet. Why then are you demanding more of the machines which have only just been born?

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MickeyRat, @EliCaesar >> you can't teach an A.I. to have fluid dance moves or Martial arts . I'd say that depends upon your point of view: https://youtu.be/auix-QLJwSo

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@EliCaesar, @MickeyRat >> However, you can't define what makes humans distinct from machines in any sense other than the physical. Indeed, I would assert that there is no difference at all aside from perhaps the method of design and perhaps the designer. By which I don't particularly refer to the creator as much as I do the apparent aspect of highly-optimized generative design versus a simple top-down directed design with limited iterations. And while in the biological instance you can certainly point out the multiple layering of complexity and extreme recombination of finely-honed elements and processes to achieve such exquisite examples of minimal form and maximal function-- ultimately at the end, all are simply machines. And I think it is also appropriate here to recollect Arthur C. Clark's famous assertion that any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. Meaning, in my opinion, that ignorance of operation cannot in and of itself prove suitable disqualification for what is so elegantly crafted.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@EliCaesar An interesting video: https://youtu.be/CZ1200kMl4A And another: https://youtu.be/uSUOdu_5MPc

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MickeyRat >> I do see some hope. We've had nuclear weapons for over 70 years. They've only been used twice in one conflict. Thermonuclear weapons were developed about 4 years later and no one's ever used one. Given our long history of conflict, I find that astounding. It can't go on forever but, it's shocking it's gone on as long as it has. That's a good observation, but I think the issue there may be more about practical matters than about wisdom or discretion. Sarin gas-- and other nerve agents-- are easier to make and acquire, and they have been used at various times and in a number of contexts, demonstrating that people aren't so much shy of using such weapons but perhaps simply preferring that a strong puff of wind can neutralize the threat as they wheel in to take over the territory.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MickeyRat comments on Apr 25, 2019:

I think you're ignoring human nature. Unless people change radically, there will always be some form of interpersonal/interregional conflict, competition, tribalism, etc. I suspect it might even be a survival characteristic. Most human universals are. The lion's share of the basic technology ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@EliCaesar >> Tribalism needs to stop and the best way for that is to stop the Dogmatic shit of Religion Politics and Race. The problem is that we're fighting the wrong battle with the wrong group, IMO. In my view there are two groups-- one is controlling, or probably more correctly encouraging and egging-- the other group. One group is busy insinuating themselves into the mantles of power. The other group is a bunch of feckless jack-asses who couldn't find their own bottoms with both hands and a gps. As we're racing along in our clown cars gunning for the gap, the first group is using the second group as foils to lash out and crash against our cars hoping to startle us and distract us while they pull ahead.

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MADcHATTER comments on May 15, 2019:

For such a quorum is there a test to pass or metric we must demonstrate to attend? Or is just the claim of possessing such intellect sufficient? Shall we provide documentation of past varying IQ tests passed or perform feats of mnemonic legerdemain to delight the senses and influence the crowd?

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MADcHATTER Just out of curiosity, which do you think is dumber, the box or the rocks?

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MADcHATTER comments on May 15, 2019:

For such a quorum is there a test to pass or metric we must demonstrate to attend? Or is just the claim of possessing such intellect sufficient? Shall we provide documentation of past varying IQ tests passed or perform feats of mnemonic legerdemain to delight the senses and influence the crowd?

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

Yes, there is a metric and you need to terminate your membership now as you obviously missed the initial challenge. We'll give you one opportunity to redeem yourself. Are you a turtle?

For a group consisting of members with triple-digit IQ's, it sure is pretty quiet in here.

MADcHATTER comments on May 15, 2019:

I used to believe that Human Kind was evolving into a more enlightened species. Mired in its own technological advances and striving to do and become more as rapidly as possible. But the last couple of decades has shown me that simply is not the case. Intellectually many are devolving or, more ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

Interestingly, lemmings don't do that. But that's a matter for a different conversation ;-) >> Common sense, knowledge, wisdom, critical thinking, skeptical analysis, theory disproval or scientific truth are now enemies of the state. No they're not, they're simply the **weapons** of the state. And moreover, we need to be careful that we correctly identify just *who* "The State" actually is. Consider that "The State" is simply a machine-- a marionette of sorts which cannot move or perform any thought or action on its own. It is up to the people who pull its strings to do the thinking and give it animus. Who are *those* people? Yesterday you thought you knew. They were the wall street banker types. Big oil. Big pharma. The military-industrial complex. Today however, those people you used to know are changing into different people. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss, right? The new boss wants total fealty. Wants to control not only the way you act, but what you say and think too. The old boss wanted that too but since they didn't control your ability to speak and communicate to quite the same degree they had to manipulate you via subtler means to gain your compliance. So they're subsidizing the loony-left and giving them all of the green lights and okay signals-- oops, wrong metaphor-- thumbs-up signals... using their position and technology to turn the world upside down and into a left-wing authoritarian's wet dream. And the situation will continue for as long as people are married to the machine. It dictates our every move. We can't step out of line or we'll be censored, de-platformed and un-personed. And in today's highly-interconnected world, you're nothing without an Internet account and a media platform with which to use it. Certainly vestiges of the old paradigm still exist and will yet for some time. It takes time to get everything re-coded and re-engineered to work in the new way. Every day more and more of us face the inevitable choice. Accept the new paradigm or lose our perceived personage. It's possible that a new platform will emerge and in time gain enough power and financial wherewithal to push back. As I've said elsewhere, society exists at the tip-of-the-spear and when an opportunity presents itself for one faction to gain advantage they will press it forward while all the others jockey around for new position. It's sort of like playing 'musical chairs' and 'twister' at the same time while simultaneously juggling spinning chain saws, eating crackers and whistling 'Dixie'-- oh wait, 'Dixie' is out. Whatever. They aren't targeting the actual "Far Right", or even particularly the "Moderate Left" as long as they're smart enough to keep their traps shut. They're going after the Skeptical community and doing their best to ...

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

TommyB comments on May 12, 2019:

"Local or Federal: Best Way to Fix Americas Ills Group" I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiment, and i may be completely off base here 'cause i'm not a lawyer, but the one thing i see that could prevent this so far, is the fact that the Constitution ALSO forbids gov't interference into ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@TommyB You're missing the point. It doesn't matter what contract or "terms of service" Twitter has since they are unenforceable by definition. Allowing Hamas to have an account on the the platform is offering "aid and comfort" to America's enemy. If it happened this morning and they didn't know-- they could argue that it was an automated process and they're acting to take action now that they've been notified. That would be a reasonable action taken in a reasonable time to correct the situation as soon as they're made aware. But Hamas has had the account on Twitter for years. And Twitter has been made aware of the fact by no less than the President of the United States, the person-- I would think-- more than any other who would know, or should know, more than any other. And since Twitter has shown ample interest in removing people both before and since, the only reasonable assumption here is that they're not lazy. They know and they just don't care. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse, right? And since they permit the situation to continue, at this point it's on them.

The Hard Problems of Consciousness Lately, the likes of Sam Harris devotees, along with ...

jwhitten comments on May 1, 2019:

Do you suppose that the concept of 'free will' must necessarily suppose / include the ability to *act* upon that perception? Meaning that it is not simply enough to perceive a situation and make a choice, but to also have the ability to effect that choice within or upon the world. And I don't ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@Dlaing1986 In what way did I move the goal posts?

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

Roobie comments on May 13, 2019:

I just spoke to a friend who teaches in a large school district in Minneapolis. He’s leaving. He said that the restrictions on what they can and can’t say in reference to anything of religious context is unreasonable, and at the same time are knocking themselves to accommodate all things ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

If it's in America and they're a public school there's not much they CAN say to him. He has the right to say what he wants.

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

Babou comments on May 12, 2019:

I doubt very much if the founding fathers were thinking about individuals rather than nations when they spoke of “enemies of the United States.” Think of all the war victims of the US from good wars to bad wars, from Hiroshima kids in WWII to landmine injured Cambodians, to blown-up Iraqi ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

Also I think there is a Y-U-G-E difference in rendering emergency first aid-- or even humanitarian aid-- and everyday run-of-the-mill sort of services such as permitting them to use your world-wide communications network to-- you know-- facilitate their communications.

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

Babou comments on May 12, 2019:

I doubt very much if the founding fathers were thinking about individuals rather than nations when they spoke of “enemies of the United States.” Think of all the war victims of the US from good wars to bad wars, from Hiroshima kids in WWII to landmine injured Cambodians, to blown-up Iraqi ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

Hmm... tell that to Benedict Arnold.

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

TommyB comments on May 12, 2019:

"Local or Federal: Best Way to Fix Americas Ills Group" I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiment, and i may be completely off base here 'cause i'm not a lawyer, but the one thing i see that could prevent this so far, is the fact that the Constitution ALSO forbids gov't interference into ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

You can't enter into a contract for something that's illegal. For example, I couldn't legally hire you to kill somebody. That's against the law and thus I couldn't enter into a legally-binding contract with you to do it. The bit about treason though is written into our Constitution itself, which if you think about it, precedes the actual law. It is the principle that the law is written on. And I stated both the Constitutional definition and the version in the US Code in my post, so you're covered either way I think. ;-)

We live under such well-crafted illusions; the biggest is perhaps the one that is known as the ...

Serg97 comments on May 5, 2019:

Let me tell you a true related story. About 7 years ago a customer came in to the establishment where I work. We are in the business of buying and selling gold and silver, along with many other things. The customer, I mentioned, appeared to be in his mid 90's, well dressed in a business suit. We got...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@Serg97 I think that was my point.

More CNN incredulity.

jwhitten comments on May 8, 2019:

Alternatively, seeing as how their ratings are down in the toilet and they're laying off staff left and right, they may be moving to the "water's edge" in a bid to commit corporate suicide by drowning.

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@MADcHATTER MAKE is such a strong word... let's say, limit your creative options... ;-)

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 16, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles Hello - sorry for the delay in responding-- my weeks are insanely complicated at the moment... >>To answer your question about how I think socialism should be implemented, let me start by saying that I'm not seeking revolutionary change. That's what they all say... until they've confiscated all the guns and ammunition... But, it's at least good to hear you say it, we can bring that back up at your trial! ;-) BTW-- in sincerity, thanks for answering the question. >>I seek a socialism built on top of the US Constitution and driven by republican (small r) values. If we were starting from scratch I might go for something closer to libertarian socialism. I don't know your definition of that, but I would say that would simply be me doing me but making the occasional *voluntary* contributions. >>But the powers of the existing US state have a lot going for them so my plan would look like something closer to social democracy. That sounds a bit more like 'wealth redistribution'. But if we're just talking roads, infrastructure and the common good, I'm not as far away as you might think. >>I don't think the following is that different from existing successful mixed economies, so I'm not worried that it would end in catastrophe. The remedy for any failures would be democracy. You mean, the 'Social' kind... >>Tax billionaires and multimillionaires more to combat extreme income inequality (e.g., wealth tax, graduated income tax, capital gains tax, loophole closing, IRS audits, and shutting down tax shelters) That's where I think you just went wrong. Not necessarily in your intent, but in your methodology. Me, I'm perfectly okay with billionaires as long as they're rewarding the people who took the risk along with them. But, by "risks" I don't just means the risks of success, but also the risks of FAILURE, which most people don't stop to think about. If you (the potential businessman) go into business and leave behind a huge, stinking, smoldering, radioactive crater-- the community has to clean that up. That's a risk THEY took right along with you. One that most "self-righteous" Capitalists would rather you not remember. Not that I'm not a self-righteous Capitalist myself, mostly-- but just being honest about it. The general consensus among Capitalists seems to be "Privatize the assets, Socialize the liabilities." I personally don't think it should work quite that way. But instead of *taxing* it out of them, they should be sharing the rewards more equitably up-front, which also includes the community. I also don't see any problem with communities having stock / equity ownership in companies. As long as their stakes are managed by an independent, arms-length board. That would help communities get a better return on their localized...

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

MilesPurdue comments on May 10, 2019:

I will start with having a post in more than one group does distract following and having debate. So far I see no statement showing action to call treason. I'll see bad business ethics and an ideology push but no push against the U.S. Government or release of military activity. Most CEOs do not ...

jwhitten replies on May 11, 2019:

@MilesPurdue I understand how small phones make it difficult to read. You have my complete sympathies. If it was you or I helping Hamas, or any other group the government has designated as a "terrorist group" we wouldn't be having this discussion because we'd be too busy being in jail and getting raked over the coals. However, these companies are doing exactly that and are thumbing their noses at the laws and Constitution of the United States. Whether or not the United States itself gives aid and comfort to its enemies is concerning, and I would like to put pressure on them to stop doing that too. Do you have any specific infomation about that? We can make a post about it. So rather than NOT doing something about the one thing that we KNOW is happening, why don't we do TWO things and solve BOTH problems. We have 325 Million people in the United States-- surely we can do at least TWO things at the same time??

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

JacintaL comments on May 10, 2019:

This should be a petition.

jwhitten replies on May 11, 2019:

By all means-- please make it so.

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

MilesPurdue comments on May 10, 2019:

I will start with having a post in more than one group does distract following and having debate. So far I see no statement showing action to call treason. I'll see bad business ethics and an ideology push but no push against the U.S. Government or release of military activity. Most CEOs do not ...

jwhitten replies on May 10, 2019:

I think you are missing the point. They are providing services to Hamas, which is a declared foreign terrorist group by the United States. It doesn't matter how you or I *feel* about it, the United States has so designated it and thus they are "the enemy", by definition. Twitter and the others allow them (Hamas) to have an account and a presence on their site. Thus they are engaged in the actual, real, factual practice of providing "aid and comfort" to a real declared enemy of the United States. They have been TOLD they are doing it. They also make a regular effort to remove accounts from their site-- so they cannot claim that they are lazy. Thus, the only answer is that they know and that's what they want, or else they know and they just don't care. Either way, it's irrelevant because *THEY KNOW* and they haven't done diddly squat to remove the account(s) and stop servicing America's enemies. Thus, according to the CONSTITUTION-- not even "just the law"-- they are guilty of Treason against the United States of America, a crime which if found guilty, is punishable by death.

Twitter and YouTube Engaged in Treason Something James Woods said this morning got me ...

Garsco comments on May 10, 2019:

As long as the trial isn’t held in the US House of Representatives... It would be interesting indeed if this could get any traction. Leftists would viciously howl. Most Republicans would step back cowardly into the shadows. But, hey, send it on to Bill Barr, the President, and Ted Cruz. Maybe ...

jwhitten replies on May 10, 2019:

We are all witnesses. The issue in this case will not be finding a witness but rather the difficult task of limiting it to just two.

Ok....silly Sign Time. Do you have a silly sign that actually exists?

jwhitten comments on May 8, 2019:

I'll eat a pickle but I won't lick a dog's butt. It's funny how things work.

jwhitten replies on May 8, 2019:

@MADcHATTER My mother taught me to aim higher in life.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

jwhitten comments on May 6, 2019:

Because the Lefties aren't able to form theories??

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@DrN1 Hmm... does that count as a double-negative??

Beto said it best when he almost said, “Desperate times call for desperate candidates and I’m ...

jwhitten comments on May 2, 2019:

Given his proclivity for standing upon tables and bartops, he may literally topple out of the race at any moment.

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@An_Ominous She's more of a south-wind, I'd say.

Beto said it best when he almost said, “Desperate times call for desperate candidates and I’m ...

jwhitten comments on May 2, 2019:

Given his proclivity for standing upon tables and bartops, he may literally topple out of the race at any moment.

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@An_Ominous LOL.

Beto said it best when he almost said, “Desperate times call for desperate candidates and I’m ...

jwhitten comments on May 2, 2019:

Given his proclivity for standing upon tables and bartops, he may literally topple out of the race at any moment.

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@An_Ominous No, but the guys are still working hard to strap her on to the thing. Trouble is she keeps breaking free and runs off crying about how "they're all out to get her and no body will listen. That is when she's not busy whining about some woman named Miss Ogeny, and nobody knows who she is..??

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@Gerri4321 >> "Reptilen is a Sir name that King Charles traced his bloodline back too." It's polite to announce "Playing Through" as it gives the other participants an opportunity to step out of the way ;-)

Beto said it best when he almost said, “Desperate times call for desperate candidates and I’m ...

jwhitten comments on May 2, 2019:

Given his proclivity for standing upon tables and bartops, he may literally topple out of the race at any moment.

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@An_Ominous Ugh. God'll get you for that someday. Mark my words! ;-)

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

chuckpo comments on May 6, 2019:

There is no right thinking outside of radical left thinking. They've relegated any person to the right of them--even only slightly--to the KKK--to be ignored, dismissed, condescended, mocked. 'conspiracy theory', 'nazi', 'fascist', 'racist', 'sexist', 'xenophobe', 'homophobe'--all of these terms are...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@chuckpo No worries, Dude! It's all good ;-)

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@iThink, @chuckpo I think I agree with you Chuckpo, it always seems to degenerate into a specific set of factions with a distinct hierarchical social structure. You have the ruling elite class at the top, however that's organized. You have the 'intelligensia', which for the most part tend to be a whiny bunch of suck-ups. And out of that group you have a few truly independent thinkers / dissidents who are willing to throw great big ideological rocks at the establishment (who thus need to be "taken care of"). You have the "enforcer" class who gets special perks and privileges (because everybody's afraid of them) who are willing to go out and bash some heads on demand. You have the "merry ship of fools" contingent who are busy running around in all directions saying and doing decidedly stupid things, but who are otherwise largely harmless apart from being "the mob" and the "eggers-on" as needed. Then you have the masses, the majority of people who are just regular, middle-of-the-road mainstream folks who just want to keep their heads down, live a nice little life, put something aside for their children, have a good time once in awhile and generally live-and-let-live. Then finally you have the dregs of society, the underclasses who are hopelessly mired in their own filth and shit and who will never amount to anything more than hungry mouths to feed. In this group you also have the petty criminal class, the robbers, thieves, muggers, grifters, pick-pockets and all-around no-good dirty louses. Any of them with any actual ambition or ability would have moved up into a higher tier and become a banker. You could also make a pretty good argument that the above represents all human societies though and you probably wouldn't have to work too hard to convince me. -- >> "why doesn't one faction stand up against the radicalization of another branch? It would be organic to see those values clash at least at the level of comparing and contrasting ideas. I've literally never seen it." There are a couple of reasons here-- first among them, I think-- "professional courtesy"... ;-) Kidding aside, I think it comes down to the fact that people are comprised of complex, often-conflicting mores, beliefs and attitudes (which we would collectively describe as "culture") and a tiny wee bit of schadenfreude, taking delight in other people's misery. I think that all things being equal, people tend to gravitate towards other people who are more ideologically like themselves and away from people they consider have differing views. But as societies grow larger and more complex and the number of ideas and "ways to be" grow seemingly exponentially with them, it is increasingly difficult for people to sort themselves out into harmonious ideological patterns, and thus are...

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@iThink, @chuckpo This is addressed toward @WilyRickWiles, but anybody feel free to chip in an opinion... Real question, no gotchas-- Let us assume for the point of discussion that we're correct in the proposition that 'there has never been a known, successful instance of nation-level socialism / communism enacted in the world'. You have all of the known world history to draw from as your example pool... (and if you vehemently disagree with the proposition, why do you think it's incorrect?) So given the above, what do you think the correct way to implement socialism / communism would be. What would it look like? How would it be regulated and governed? What is it about either the ideal or the practical reality which has gone wrong in every other known implementation that would be different in your scheme? How would you ensure it? What would be the remedy if you're wrong?

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@iThink >> "There are plenty of armed preppers who also call themselves "liberals" Like, totally! ;-)

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@iThink And not for nothing, committing voter fraud should be considered a willful hostile and seditious action committed against the people, as voting is the most fundamental and basic right which is entrusted unto the citizen. It is a different sort of a crime to vote more than once or to vote fraudulently, and even more so when the person committing the act is not a citizen. And when I say 'different sort of crime', I don't mean just this kind of misdemeanor or that sort of felony-- I mean that it is darned near a **TREASONOUS ACT** because its entire point and purpose is to undermine the legitimate will of the citizenry. So while I don't think a violent reaction is warranted for one single individual case, nor even for a few isolated cases. When it becomes hundreds, thousands, or tens of thousands-- my opinion changes dramatically and I think people who do commit voter fraud ought to be looking fervently over their shoulders as they slink away.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

chuckpo comments on May 6, 2019:

There is no right thinking outside of radical left thinking. They've relegated any person to the right of them--even only slightly--to the KKK--to be ignored, dismissed, condescended, mocked. 'conspiracy theory', 'nazi', 'fascist', 'racist', 'sexist', 'xenophobe', 'homophobe'--all of these terms are...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@iThink I agree that we must hear them for a variety of reasons. That they're human beings, being the first among them. We don't want to treat them the way they treat us or else what would be the difference between us? We'd simply be a different tribe. Also, fwiw, my comment to Chuckpo was mostly in jest, he just responded to it seriously, so I went with it.

I am an interested and reasonably well-informed lay person, not a statistician, but I have learned ...

MADcHATTER comments on May 6, 2019:

You have provided inferential statistics, left out the descriptive statistics. Inferential Statistics: making statements about a larger group than we have been provided data for. Without the Descriptive statistics...summarizing data is, at best, difficult for us to derive a probability for a correct...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

Average age of men guessing what the population pool is???

Does anybody else share my impression that the "intellectual" Dark Web is dumbing down, getting ...

jwhitten comments on May 7, 2019:

Maybe the left was right... Yes. I have noticed a bit of a 'dumbing down' in some areas. There are topics that I've seen which seem really good that never get picked-up and bandied about. Not sure why. Perhaps people just get intellectually tired. As a sort of an aside, I am curious about not...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@DrN1 Maybe a sign: <========[ Your IQ Must Be This Tall to Post ]

Does anybody else share my impression that the "intellectual" Dark Web is dumbing down, getting ...

jneedler comments on May 6, 2019:

I actually considered making a similar post yesterday. I think it's natural that as the site attracts more attention, it also attracts more people who are: * less capable of engaging in reasoned discussion * interested in engaging in more lighthearted interactions (jokes, memes, cartoons, ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

I think the lighter fare is fine, particularly the humor stuff. It would be nice though if that kind of stuff could just simply be interleaved with the rest of the more substantive content. So it'd be more along the lines of read a bit, snack on a meme or a funny thing, and then read some more and so on. Give yourself a quick mental break and then back to it.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

https://youtu.be/zw-FF6CPmvs

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles I actually consider myself a classic liberal and more of a center moderate-- perhaps slightly right of center these days-- and I have been so for years. All the while watching while the left has gotten whackier and whackier by the hour. I admit / agree that I have historically had somewhat of a problem with the old-guard Republicans, but a good chunk of them are dead and gone at this point. And when it comes to 'conspiracy theories' you bunch take the cake with all your 'Collusion', 'Russia', 'Orange-Man-Bad' and other BS. You've spent the entirety of the past two years, not even counting all the time in the run-up before the election, hating on Donald Trump and haven't so much as even considered putting together any meaningful party platform. I reckon you're sure that "Mueller Lied" is gonna get you the win? That actually sounds like a perfectly sound strategy to me, here's hoping you bring it home on election day. BTW-- you might want to let Creepy Joe know that Margy Thatcher is d.e.d. But okay, what "different leftist strands representing different philosophies and different interests" did you have in mind?

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 7, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles I don't have a desire for "social conformity", that's your department. The irony that you're completely missing is if we here were anything like your so 'liberal' Left, **you** wouldn't be here having a casual ideological discussion-- because you would have been ousted, "othered", "de-platformed" and summarily ejected by now. I don't agree with your viewpoint or politics, but I'm just fine with you having one, and quite okay that it doesn't match mine. That's what **tolerance** is actually about. https://youtu.be/6grXCooL3-M

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles I was simply agreeing with @iThink when he pointed out that every shining example of socialism / communism to-date has ended in the untimely deaths of many tens of millions. You lefties are an interesting bunch. You claim you value "free speech" as you beat up the dissidents. You claim you value diversity as you purge anyone with a different point of view from your ranks. You claim you love "liberty" as you lock 'em up in the gulags. And you claim you "value life" as you shoot 'em in the back of the head. Personally I think the world has experienced enough "Liberal Values" to last at least a millennia or more.

American Airlines is allowing passengers to register as Non BInary.

CodeBuster comments on May 4, 2019:

I'm a hexadecimal kind of guy myself.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@CodeBuster I'll see your Holy Grail and raise you a Dead Parrot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnciwwsvNcc

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles "Messy" is an interesting way to describe the wanton murder of 70-100 million people because you can't handle political criticism... I don't think that word 'solidarity' means what you think it means-- in fact, I think you offed pretty much everybody who did know. Ooops! The modern left is all about ideological festoonery, episodic political expediency, transient alliance, and a bullet in the back of the head by way of thanks. 'Cause you know, "parting is such sweet sorrow" and all that...

American Airlines is allowing passengers to register as Non BInary.

CodeBuster comments on May 4, 2019:

I'm a hexadecimal kind of guy myself.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@CodeBuster Oiy! I'm not dead yet!

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles Those liberals overthrew the feudal aristocracy and then proceeded to murder 70-100 million people. Some "liberation". Current day "Liberals" aren't doing jack shit for the working classes. They're keeping them struggling in place, right where they want them, so they think they're getting something and keep voting for the Democrats. They're catching on now. You shouldn't have given them access to the Internet 'cause they've been comparing notes.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@iThink No, I was telling you not to confuse WilyRickWiles with facts. They tend to interfere with his muttering.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

chuckpo comments on May 6, 2019:

There is no right thinking outside of radical left thinking. They've relegated any person to the right of them--even only slightly--to the KKK--to be ignored, dismissed, condescended, mocked. 'conspiracy theory', 'nazi', 'fascist', 'racist', 'sexist', 'xenophobe', 'homophobe'--all of these terms are...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@chuckpo It's darned difficult to counter without becoming them in the process. That's the insidiousness of it.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@iThink, @WilyRickWiles So you know how to use Google to look up words, but what does that even mean?

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles, @iThink Please don't confuse him with facts.

American Airlines is allowing passengers to register as Non BInary.

CodeBuster comments on May 4, 2019:

I'm a hexadecimal kind of guy myself.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@CodeBuster 57,005. Only DEAD people understand hexadecimal.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

chuckpo comments on May 6, 2019:

There is no right thinking outside of radical left thinking. They've relegated any person to the right of them--even only slightly--to the KKK--to be ignored, dismissed, condescended, mocked. 'conspiracy theory', 'nazi', 'fascist', 'racist', 'sexist', 'xenophobe', 'homophobe'--all of these terms are...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

Of course, we don't have to listen to them either, they're Leftists.

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

WilyRickWiles comments on May 6, 2019:

It's less that they're "conspiracy theorists" and more that they're "far right conspiracy theorists." The qualifier "far right" typically suggests an authoritarian and nationalist bent. Such speech has a tendency to incite violence against minorities. We're historically sensitive, for example, to ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WilyRickWiles >> "demands of a liberatory social movement in a capitalist country." What the hell does that even mean?

Why are only right-leaning people being called "Conspiracy Theorists" as they're being banned from ...

iThink comments on May 6, 2019:

I must say I find it interesting that Facebook banned Louis Farrakhan along with the likes of that idiot Alex Jones. As much as I dislike these two people I have to say neither should be banned from a site that projects an image of open dialogue and free speech. Having said that I am not sure ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@Halligan If they are receiving ONE THIN DIME of government money, even if it's for TAX RELIEF-- they can't discriminate.

American Airlines is allowing passengers to register as Non BInary.

CodeBuster comments on May 4, 2019:

I'm a hexadecimal kind of guy myself.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't...

PUBLIC INTERNET AMENDMENT: "Recognizing the importance of free speech protections of the public ...

WingedRyno comments on May 5, 2019:

One thing to be hammered out, and maybe the language could be better to make it explicit, but just who gets to use the internet (citizens as it stands now) brings in the issue of identification (how do we know you're a citizen) and also funding issues (do individuals all pay the same or do those who...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

I think you would simply treat it the same as you do the actual real public street today. How do we know you're a citizen there? We don't really. Not generally.

PUBLIC INTERNET AMENDMENT: "Recognizing the importance of free speech protections of the public ...

jwhitten comments on May 5, 2019:

Yeah, I've thought about that before, but I think having big-brother running my social platform would give me the creeps. But on the other hand, there is the reality of the creeps running my social platform acting like big-brother. So I guess it's six one way and about half-a-dozen the other.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@WingedRyno Sure, I understand and fwiw I'm supportive. If I were able to vote on it, I'd pull the lever right now.

There are many criticisms of the concept of God which atheists come up with, and it is not clear to ...

jwhitten comments on May 4, 2019:

Yup, that's one of the questions I'd like to know the answer to-- without the usual bullshit that usually goes along with it.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@RichardPD looking forward to checking it out this evening. Thanks!

There are many criticisms of the concept of God which atheists come up with, and it is not clear to ...

jwhitten comments on May 4, 2019:

Yup, that's one of the questions I'd like to know the answer to-- without the usual bullshit that usually goes along with it.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@RichardPD Did you build the arm yourself? I have a passion for robotics and automation.

In a conversation with a very judgmental Interviewer, JBP stopped the conversation and made the ...

Troy_Alias comments on May 4, 2019:

I'm not sure . But I will say one thing. If my overall view is in fact guided by a bias I was taught.. I am so grateful that I was taught a rational point of view. I mean that sincerely.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@DocWatty And at the same time I would wager that most of us are carrying around a bit more intellectual and ideological luggage than we care to admit. We might have hidden it away a bit out of sight, down in the basement or stashed away in one of the boxes out in the garage. But I'll bet it wouldn't take but the right remark to get you-- or most people-- standing up quickly and out of their rational comfort zones. I don't mean that as a taunt, just simply a general observation, especially as I don't know you in any actual sense yet. So in that regard have no basis to form that opinion about you *specifically*. But I think it's true about most people that I've met. You find that right "hot-button" topic and push it-- and you're off to the races. I know that's true about me too.

Welcome New Members! We're glad you're here.

DocWatty comments on May 3, 2019:

THEY CAN’T ALL BE WRONG... and they are smarter than I am! On the big Politically charged issues... - Environmental Science opinions at 99%, - Social Correctness Issues, - MSM and DNC Narratives...just about anything that matters. You may ask could this happen? Eric ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

Thanks for sharing it. I will put that on my watch list for later this evening. I like Eric Weinstein, but I don't share all of his viewpoints. But I definitely agree that he is one smart cookie!

There are many criticisms of the concept of God which atheists come up with, and it is not clear to ...

jwhitten comments on May 4, 2019:

Yup, that's one of the questions I'd like to know the answer to-- without the usual bullshit that usually goes along with it.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@RichardPD Chess robots are good too. ;-)

We live under such well-crafted illusions; the biggest is perhaps the one that is known as the ...

Farmergramma comments on May 5, 2019:

I don't claim to be any kind of economics expert or student of gold versus dollars. I do remember the downturn after we went off the gold standard. That added to my mistrust of government! It has always fascinated me that we all agree to call a "dollar" money. In itself as a piece of paper it has ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@Republicae How do you believe that is different from the idea of money? I'm not saying that I don't agree-- but just on that basis, I'm not sure that I do. People are free to use bitcoin as a currency just as any other. I can go work for somebody and they can pay me in bitcoin and it has the value that we each understand it to have. The fact that it can fluctuate up and down at a faster rate-- or at all-- (which I *think*, if I understand you right, is the essential point that you're making??)-- seems to me to be irrelevant and irrespective of the concept of using bitcoin as "money". For that matter, I could go to work for someone and they could pay me in futures, or derivatives, or stock. Anything that we decide upon to exchange as one form of value for another-- is yanked into service as "money"-- wouldn't you agree?

We live under such well-crafted illusions; the biggest is perhaps the one that is known as the ...

jwhitten comments on May 5, 2019:

At this point the issue is moot and academic. Prices have long since adjusted to meet people's expectation for value. That's the other side of the coin that rarely gets mentioned-- no matter how much "they" tinker with the "value"-- which might very well enrich themselves-- in the broader market ...

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@Republicae I agree with that-- what you just wrote. And I think you're just saying what I said with more words, more or less. I had to clarify my own some in the subsequent comments. At the end of the day the "value of a dollar" all comes down to how much milk you can buy with it. Which is why some people choose to invest in "real" things, with the assumption that they will hold their value better-- or else provide some real actual tangible benefit at the very least. The dollar value of a house, for example, may fluctuate up and down, but at least you can always live in it. Thus it has some notional value-- some existential value which is real and distinct from its abstract market-derived economic value. Also it is useful to point out-- what you undoubtedly already understand-- that what we're dickering over here is the "exchange rate", so to speak, to go from one form of valuation to the other, wouldn't you say?

There are many criticisms of the concept of God which atheists come up with, and it is not clear to ...

jwhitten comments on May 4, 2019:

Yup, that's one of the questions I'd like to know the answer to-- without the usual bullshit that usually goes along with it.

jwhitten replies on May 6, 2019:

@RichardPD Yes, it sounds like Jordan and I have a similar take on God. My journey was a little bit different. For a number of years I railed against the notion of "God"-- of a supreme being, and most especially the value of the church-- particularly with respect to the harm its caused numerous people over the years. At some point I started having a series of little epiphanies, personal revelations which have reshaped a number of my opinions and views on God and religion and the importance of the church. Some of my very most recent, in the past couple of years have been the result of Stephan Molyneux and Jordan Peterson-- Stephan was likely influenced by Peterson too, I'd wager-- but that's a guess and I don't want to put words in his mouth that I really don't know. I've always considered the value of the church, or a church, as a "good works" society. And that concept still forms the core of my thought and forbearance towards the church. Meaning it's the one good thing that the church has going for it, IMO, that makes it worth redeeming. More on that in a bit. In the past I was quite militant in my disbelief. I don't know if I could ever really look back and claim that I was an absolute atheist, though I thought of myself that way. More of a jaded agnostic, would probably be a better way of putting it. Or perhaps a seriously unconvinced agnostic. And I don't know why I railed against the church as hard as I did. That's one of the recent-- last couple of decades-- epiphanies that I had. If it helps other people to believe in what they believe, who am I to disabuse them of those notions? What GOOD am I serving when I do that? And what harm am I causing-- particularly if I do succeed in changing or altering someone's worldview-- and who doesn't have the additional follow-on mindset / perspective to deal with it..?? I was simply attempting to take away the elements that gave them comfort, for my own jollies, and was prepared to give them-- nothing-- in return. "Enlightenment"? "Rationality"? What good are those concepts if they aren't part of your core value systems and daily functioning? I was as much proselytizing MY religion of "rationality" as they ever were. And that made me stop and reconsider myself and what my point and purpose was in doing that. It is one thing to want to have an intellectual debate. It is one thing to talk to someone who's interested in exploring ideas and new mindsets. It's another thing entirely to cause someone pain and emotional distress in the process. And that was one of the things I decided to try and change about myself. I don't know if I have achieved a perfect transformation, but I think I am decidedly better today about it than I was back then. -- Another thing that changed for me was my personal concept of ...