Amen. They did miss out the 1st Advent, but they will figure out the 2nd time around, as Stephen was about to tell the Sanhedrin before they cut him short by martyring him (if you follow the flow and direction of his talk).

@eschatologyguy

Yes, Stephen’s presentation of the gospel was God’s offer of the opportunity for Israel to carry the good news as a nation to the world. It is amazing that Saul/Paul, the "apostle of the Gentiles" (Romans 11: 13) was standing guard over their clothes as the Jews stoned faithful Stephen to death. Acts 7:58

@WorldSigh they missed it. Good thing for them (and for us) that God is a God Who keeps His word.

@eschatologyguy

Amen! I have no doubt that there will be, and are presently, many Jews anxiously awaiting and praying for the second coming of the Messiah.

"For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." Romans 2:28

@WorldSigh I think the Jews who survive Jacob's Trouble or the Great Tribulation will still have no clue that it was the Yeshua that they rejected 2 millennia before that had come to save them, until this happens:

Zechariah 12:10-11
"And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon Me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for Him, as one mourneth for his only son (who has died), and shall be in bitterness for Him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon." (Note: the succeeding verses after this make it unequivocal that this repenting people are ethnic Jews, the nation of Israel).

That mourning there (after seeing the scars on His hands, side and feet, and realizing their collective mistake ) is the repentance of the nation, and this repentance heralds the Great Reconciliation of the ages, and the start of the Lord's Millennial Reign. Amen.

@eschatologyguy

Is it possible that this prophesy was fulfilled on the day of Pentecost?

("And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications".)
Zechariah 12:10

"And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Acts 2:4

"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call."
Acts 2:38-39

("and they shall look upon Me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for Him, as one mourneth for his only son (who has died), and shall be in bitterness for Him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem" )
Zechariah 12:10-11

"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?"
Acts 2:36-37

I agree, it does seem likely that the repenting people are ethnic Jews.

"And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven". Acts 2:5

As this prophetic line continues in chapter 13, we see the words from Zechariah that Jesus quoted in Gethsemane, indicating that the time line of this prophesy is unlikely to be 2000 years after the crucifixion.

"And one shall say unto him, What are these wounds in thine hands? Then he shall answer, Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.
Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered"
Zechariah 13: 6-7

"Then saith Jesus unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad."
Matthew 26:31

@WorldSigh A big NO. Please read the prophecy on Zechariah more closely. Can you honestly say they have all been fulfilled? No, because Zach 12:10b is not a prophecy for 70AD. Also, what do you do with the tons of other end time prophecies like Hosea 5:15 and 6:1-2?

Zach 13:6-7 has been fulfilled in 32-70AD and the scattering has ended in 1948, in fulfillment of Jer 29:14. 1948 starts the countdown to the start of Jacob's Trouble and the other events just as the Lord alluded to in Matt 24 regarding the budding of the fig tree. That is why we are starting to experience what we are experiencing now: the birth pains. Remember that the Lord said from the budding of the fig tree to the Great Reconciliation and the start of the Lord's Millennial Reign will be just within the span of one lifetime. "This generation shall not pass..until ALL these things come to pass."

Preterism makes every end time prophecy Eisegesltically shoehorned into a clearly unbiblical view, forced them into this mold even if they do not fit, ignoring other prophetic passages that do not fit this interpretation. Preterism as a teaching is a kissing cousin to replacement theology. They may have their Soteriology in the ballpark, but Pastors who teach Preterism and replacement Theology are teaching doctrines of demons. Christians should run away from such teachers.

Those who are mis-taught into believing Preterism and replacement theology do not even realize that they are now siding with the world in their hate for Israel, and even supporting the partitioning of the land of Israel to hand over to her enemies. Please read Obadiah 1:8-16 as it tells us how the enemies of Israel acquired the land. And one of the reasons why the Messiah returns in anger is because the world has parted His land.

Joel 3:2
"I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for My people and for My heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted My land."

@eschatologyguy

I believe that some of the prophesies have been fulfilled, some have yet to be fulfilled, and others have dual applications. For instance Hosea 6:3, "Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth."

Pentecost will have a second greater application in the near future. Israel will indeed be called to repentance at that time, as will all of the world.

None of your indicated verses show proof of a physical Israel fulfillment. See Romans 2:28, "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

God’s promises to Israel were conditional upon their obedience.
"And it shall be our righteousness, if we observe to do all these commandments before the LORD our God, as he hath commanded us." Deuteronomy 6:25

God was long suffering through all the long centuries of their existence. He blessed them, and they rebelled. Over and over this pattern is repeated. Galatians 6:7, "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."

Jeremiah 29 is prophesying the captivity of Israel in Babylon. The people were gathered from all of the nations to which they had been scattered by the Babylonian invasion, when the command to rebuild the temple was given by the Persian king Artaxerxes in Ezra 7:11-26.
This command begins the countdown to the beginning of Christ’s ministry to Israel, pinpoints the time of His death, and indicates the time of the stoning of Stephen when physical Israel refused his appeal to repent and finally lost its role as God’s special messenger to the nations.

Daniel 9:24, "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins..."

Daniel 9:25, "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks..."

Daniel 9:26-27, "And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease."

The temple was rebuilt. The people were gathered from where they were scattered.
I see nothing to indicate that 1948 has anything to do with Biblical prophesy.

I fail to see how those who believe the words of Paul, are teaching doctrines of demons.

"he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

It is a remarkable leap for you to suggest that those who do not hold to your view "are now siding with the world in their hate for Israel"! I love the people of Israel both spiritual and physical Israel. Alas, we are saved or lost as individual people, not as church members, not as nations. I pray that each individual will turn to God and be saved.

@WorldSigh Romans 2:28-29 talks not of Gentiles, but of Jews. Yet many Gentile believers mis-use this passage as support that God has already dismissed Israel, and these people then put themselves in Israel's place. There are more professing Christians who support the partitioning of Israel to favor the Arabs who live in Judea and Samaria than who oppose the partitioning of God's land.

Those who support the partitioning of Israel are indeed on the same page as the UN. Those in the extreme supporting the killing of Jews by the hand of their enemies are on the same page as Adolf.

If you followed the pattern of what Stephen was saying to the Sanhedrin, you would have noticed that he started with their not getting it the first time and then getting it the second time. If you would make a projection of where he was getting at before he was rudely interrupted by the stoning, you would conclude that they would be getting it right in the second advent.

You yourself say that there can be dual applications of prophecy. Yet you also dismiss a lot of passages that say God is not done with Israel yet by saying otherwise.

God does not just judge individuals, He also judges nations. He returns to fight nations that are messing with Israel, Egypt, Tyre, Zidon, Edom, Moab. Look it up, its all there. He will judge the nations in the valley of Jehoshaphat, if you can recall that verse.

You see nothing in prophecy that links to 1948 because it contradicts what you have obviously been taught, that God is done with the nation of Israel. But what do you do with Amos chapter 9? Especially the last verse?

As a boy I used to use the word Jew in our language as a curse, imitating the priests. Then as I grew older and learned more from the bible, I stopped using the name Jew as a curse word. I learned that God was not done with them yet.

@eschatologyguy

I do not see any "pattern of what Stephen was saying to the Sanhedrin, ... that he started with their not getting it the first time and then getting it the second time."
Stephen simply recounted the history of Israel and its oft repeated pattern of blessings followed by rejection. He showed them their sins.

"Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,

Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?

Hath not my hand made all these things?"

Here Stephen points out that God does not dwell exclusively in Israel. All of creation is His.

"Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:

Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

At this point, they rejected the final appeal of God from the lips of Stephen:
"When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth."

"But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,

And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,"

Would you agree that continuing in sin so long that you no longer hear God’s voice is the point of no return for the sinner? They literally "stopped their ears"!

"And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.

And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep."
Stephen’s final words echo those of Jesus. "Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do."
Sadly, with fingers jammed firmly into their ears, it seems doubtful that many of them accepted that forgiveness.

"If you would make a projection of where he was getting at before he was rudely interrupted by the stoning, you would conclude that they would be getting it right in the second advent."
I will not add to the words of this book. I believe what the Bible says. I see nothing to indicate "that they would be getting it right in the second advent." It says that they turned away from the mercy of God, yet again, before murdering His messenger.

@eschatologyguy

Read the words of Paul carefully. He is reprimanding the Jews for believing they were saved by virtue of being Jews. He corrects their faulty belief by pointing out that each man is judged "according to his deeds".

"Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

For there is no respect of persons with God.

For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;"
Romans 2:6-12

I’m not certain why you are trying to educate me about recent middle eastern political history and current events? I am quite familiar with it, and for the record, I am no fan of the Islamic forces that encircle Israel, and seek to destroy it. I have studied the Quran. It is hateful, illogical, un chronological to the point of being illegible, and is demonically pathological. The slaves of Allah are probably the most satanically deluded group on earth. It is amazing how God is using people like David Wood to touch the hearts and open the eyes of so many of these people!

You continue to infer that those who disagree with you hate Israel. I cannot judge the motives of others. My understanding of scripture tells me that only Jews are saved. Unless, we are grafted into the olive tree and become Jews, we cannot be saved. By the same standard, an hereditary Jew may also be pruned from the olive tree and in the eyes of God, no longer be a Jew. So, yes the faithful nation of Israel will be saved.

"And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

(The Root is Christ! "And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious." Isaiah 11:10/Romans 15:12)

Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.

Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again."

Romans 11:17-23

Notice that it is "because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith."
Everyone who attains salvation is saved by faith alone, not by an accident of birth.
It is by faith that we are adopted into the family Israel.

"I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin."

God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,

Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."

Romans 11:1-5

Only seven thousand were faithful out of the millions of Israel.

@eschatologyguy

Incidentally, I was not raised in a religious home. No one else there cared to read the Bible. When I found God, I was told never to say the name Jesus in the house. So, there were no priests for me to learn antisemitism from. I have never used the Jews as a curse word. It would not have occurred to me.

@WorldSigh The interpretations you present on certain verses concerning Israel are standard interpretations of Replacement Theology. And Replacement Theology is a precursor of, and therfore a form of, anti-Semitism. The rise of anti-Semitism is one of the signs of the end of the age. I'd like to bring your attention to Zechariah 12:2-3:

"Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem. And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it. "
Fulfilled in 70AD?

Those 7000 found faithful will be overshadowed by the number of those saved (not faithful but saved ) during Jacob's Trouble.

Zechariah 13:8-9
"And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

How many would a third of even their current population be? And this is not even counting the 144,000 sent out to the world as witnesses for Christ just as the two witnesses start their ministry in Jerusalem. And just to make sure we know who these people are, let's check out v1.

Let's not get stuck in those verses of God's anger against Israel, because there are prophecies regarding Israel after that. The bible tells us that God does not stay angry forever, and it also tells us that the Lord is not done with Israel as a nation yet.

@eschatologyguy

————
"The interpretations you present on certain verses concerning Israel are standard interpretations of Replacement Theology. And Replacement Theology is a precursor of, and therfore a form of, anti-Semitism. The rise of anti-Semitism is one of the signs of the end of the age. I'd like to bring your attention to Zechariah 12:2-3:"

I’m afraid slapping a label on ("Replacement Theology" ) a legitimate interpretation does not make an accusation true, any more than having heard it before does. Zechariah 12:2-3 Can and must be applied to spiritual Israel. Please reread Romans 2:28. The promises of God are for spiritual Israel.
"Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision. (STRONGS NT 2699: κατατομή - to cut up, mutilate)
For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh." Philippians 3:2-3

————

"Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem. And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it. "
Fulfilled in 70AD?"

I believe this has yet to be fulfilled, but the time is not far. Soon, the powers of this world will be arrayed fully against all of those who follow God. Again, see how Jesus tells the Samaritan woman that the time of physical Israel as the sole vessel of God’s truth is drawing to a close.

"Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."
John 4:20-24

————

Those 7000 found faithful will be overshadowed by the number of those saved (not faithful but saved ) during Jacob's Trouble.

Hebrews 11:6
"But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."

Luke 7:50
"And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace."

Luke 18:42
"And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee."

Ephesians 2:8
"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:"

"for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.’" Revelation 5:9-10

————

Zechariah 13:8-9
"And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God."

How many would a third of even their current population be? And this is not even counting the 144,000 sent out to the world as witnesses for Christ just as the two witnesses start their ministry in Jerusalem. And just to make sure we know who these people are, let's check out v1."

I do agree that many physical Jews will be saved. However, they will not be saved by virtue of the circumcision which is of the flesh. It is a circumcised heart that is open to the Spirit of salvation.

Are you certain that the symbols in prophesy are always to be interpreted literally? 144,000; two witnesses? For example, do you believe that Revelation 12 is speaking literally of "a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:"?
Or, "a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads."?

Verse 9 tells us the dragon is a symbol: "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."

————

"Let's not get stuck in those verses of God's anger against Israel, because there are prophecies regarding Israel after that. The bible tells us that God does not stay angry forever, and it also tells us that the Lord is not done with Israel as a nation yet."

It is dangerous to believe that God’s patience with people or nations will last forever. Men of Noah’s day thought the same.

Genesis 6:3
"And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also [is] flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years."

God does not change. It is no different in our day or 2000 years ago, a physical nation made up of individual human beings, may reach the limits of God’s mercy, by plugging our ears. The fault is not in God, it is in ourselves...

Revelation 22:11
"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still."

————

There are two baptisms: baptism of water and baptism of the Holy Spirit. As the whole world was baptized by a flood, so it will soon be baptized by fire. There are two circumcisions: one of the flesh and one of the heart. If you witness to Jewish people, I hope you will tell them that possessing a rich and wonderful heritage will in no way save them. I hope you will urge them to seek a change of heart.

"A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh." Ezekiel 36:26

@WorldSigh the difference in the interpretation is subtle, and it has everything to do to making the interpretation jibe with the belief that "Israel is done for" and now the Church has taken over its place. Like "spiritualizing" the meaning of Israel to mean the Church. That interpretation leans heavily upon the works of Origen and Augustine, who allegorized much of the bible, especially Eschatology. The rulers paid the salaries of the ministers of the church during their time, and they probably found it difficult to preach Jesus coming back to rid the world of its, well, evil rulers. So now it was "Christ is already back to rule in our hearts", and that was supposed to be Christ's Millennial Reign already. Never mind if Gabriel announced to Mary that the baby she will have will one day be sitting on the throne of David. Never mind if Zachariah prophesied that a third of the nation of Israel will survive Jacob's Trouble, be tried as silver and tested as gold, and will be calling upon the name of God, and God will be acknowledging them by calling them His people. And many more passages like this. It became "we are now in the kingdom of Christ" for Origen and Augustine. Except, WW1 and WW2 happened and it became obvious that the world was not getting any better. So parts of end time prophecies are now being entertained, but the parts of end time prophecy that clearly talk about Israel and her role in the end times are now suddenly talking about the church.

@eschatologyguy

Please, forgive me, I had a question I forgot to ask from one of your earlier posts.

"1948 starts the countdown to the start of Jacob's Trouble and the other events just as the Lord alluded to in Matt 24 regarding the budding of the fig tree. That is why we are starting to experience what we are experiencing now: the birth pains. Remember that the Lord said from the budding of the fig tree to the Great Reconciliation and the start of the Lord's Millennial Reign will be just within the span of one lifetime. "This generation shall not pass..until ALL these things come to pass."

It is written that a literal generation is 40 years. "And the LORD'S anger was kindled against Israel, and he made them wander in the wilderness forty years, until all the generation, that had done evil in the sight of the LORD, was consumed." Numbers 32:13

If your prophetic countdown began in 1948, wouldn’t the time of Jacob’s Trouble have begun in 1988?
I must have missed it.

@WorldSigh If you read numbers 32:13 again you will see that the emphasis is the dying off of the disobedient first. It's just that it took 40 years. "This generation shall not pass" doesn't mean its over in 40 or even in 80 years. It means that that generation who were alive at the start of the countdown, that is, the reistablishment of the state of Israel in 1948, wlll still be alive when the Great Reconciliation of Zach 12:10 happens. Some people today live to be a hundred, and some even older. If you apply Sir Robert Anderson's method in unravelling the prophetic riddle of Dan 9:25 (he nailed it - read his book published in the late 1800s "The Coming Prince" ) and apply it to Hosea 6:1-2 but using 2Peter 3:8 as your key, you get an exact date. But first you have to figure out what the "smiting" in Hosea 6:1-2 means and what date it happened, because that will be your terminus a quo or start date unto the binding up of Israel's severe chastisement from God. At this point in time, I will no longer build a house; I will just rent one.

Here's the pattern Stephen presented:

1. In Acts 7:3 God tells Abram to leave his kindred, come out of his country to check out the land that God was going to give him in Canaan. Yet Abram would not leave his father and brought him up to Haran (did not get). God had take Abram's father by death so he could proceed to Canaan. (Gen 11:31-32, Acts 7:4 - get ).

2. Acts 7:8-10 Stephen talks about the 12 sons of Jacob, 11 of whom sold the youngest Joseph into slavery in Egypt. When there was famine in Canaan, the 11 went to Egypt but did not recognize Joseph (did not get) . It was on their second trip (v13) when they finally did (get) .

3. Then came the account of Moses who tried to rally and save his people, but they did not understand or recognize him (vss 25-27 not get ). And the second time he came (vss 35-36), his people believed and followed him (get) .

4. After that came the wandering for 40 years in the wilderness because of their disobedience (not get) until only their offspring remained to enter the land in obedience (get) .

5. Then the accusation to the Sanhedrin of not receiving The Just One and even killing Him (vss 51-53 not get). But Stephen is cut short by the stoning.

@eschatologyguy

Thank you for the interesting info on early church history. Unfortunately, it does nothing to answer the numerous Bible quotations I have given. For instance:

"But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." Romans 2:28
This is perfectly straightforward. Does the devout Jew and Apostle of the Gentiles, Paul not mean what he says, here?

Hebrews 11:6
"But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."

You cannot be saved by virtue of being born a Jew. Everyone, gentile or Jew, must be saved by faith.

Romans 11:17-23, which shows that the olive tree (Israel) has Jews removed from the tree, and gentiles grafted into it, yet it is still the one olive tree that is Israel.

"Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.

Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee."

A Jew is someone who comes to God in faith.

@WorldSigh Romans 2:28 talks about Jews. Some are sincere Jews and some are pretend Jews. That's all it says. It doesn't say all the nation of Israel are pretend Jews and the Church would now be the real Jews. Because if its the latter, you will be forced to allegorize a lot of prophecies concerning Israel.

Heb 11:6 says what it says. Same with the rest.

Not being facetious, just as feminists hate men yet want to be like men, replacement theologists dismiss Jews yet want to be Jews. Its a total misappropriation. Jews are Jews (God will judge who is pretend and who is not) and Gentile believers are Gentile believers. Both as distinct groups can be read in Revelation. Both have different programs, but they co-mingle in the end.

Take the parable of the foolish and wise virgins. If they represent the Church, then who is the bride in the parable that is hidden early?

@eschatologyguy

4. "After that came the wandering for 40 years in the wilderness because of their disobedience (not get) until only their offspring remained to enter the land in obedience (get) ."

Are you saying Israel had to obey to (get)? Don’t they all receive automatic salvation at the time of the end?

"...unto the days of David;
Who found favour before God, and desired to find a tabernacle for the God of Jacob.
But Solomon built him an house.
Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
Hath not my hand made all these things?" Acts 7:45-50

God does not require a physical dwelling place. "the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands".
Anymore than He needs a physical country. "Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord".

5. "Then the accusation to the Sanhedrin of not receiving The Just One and even killing Him (vss 51-53 not get). But Stephen is cut short by the stoning."

"Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth."
Acts 7:51-54

Stephen was not cut short. This was his summation of the numerous blessings, they had received:
"Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it."

This was his summation of their national crimes against God, culminating in the murder of Christ.
"Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers".

The Old Testament promises were conditional on obedience through faith, as they are for each of us today. Do you seriously expect me to believe that God promised to bless physical Israel with zero conditions? In that case, everyone is saved. Hitler and Moses should have lots to talk about at the banquet in heaven!

Who was Paul speaking to here?

"Hebrews 11:6
"But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him." (Unless, you were lucky enough to be born Jewish. Then you get a free pass into heaven...)

@eschatologyguy

"Romans 2:28 talks about Jews. Some are sincere Jews and some are pretend Jews. That's all it says. It doesn't say all the nation of Israel are pretend Jews and the Church would now be the real Jews."

"Therefore if the uncircumcision (GENTILES) keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision (GENTILES) be counted for circumcision (JEW)?"

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"Heb 11:6 says what it says. Same with the rest."

And, what it and the rest say is that it is faith that saves us. Irrespective of being Russian, English, Canadian, Filipino, Ethiopian, or Jewish we are all the same in the eyes of God. By faith we are grafted into the Jewish family tree, by faithlessness others are pruned from its branches.

————

"Not being facetious, just as feminists hate men yet want to be like men, replacement theologists dismiss Jews yet want to be Jews. Its a total misappropriation.

In spite of my repeated objections, you continue to infer that anyone who does not accept your version of the Jewish role in end times events is antisemitic.
So, holding a different view from yours is hate speech... Where have I heard that before?

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"Jews are Jews (God will judge who is pretend and who is not) and Gentile believers are Gentile"

It is written: "For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."
Romans 11:10-13

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"Both as distinct groups can be read in Revelation. Both have different programs, but they co-mingle in the end."

You never replied to my previous post on this topic. So, you do believe that prophesy, including Revelation, is to be interpreted literally? The dragon in Revelation 12 is Satan’s true physical form?

————

"Take the parable of the foolish and wise virgins. If they represent the Church, then who is the bride in the parable that is hidden early?"

I’m not certain what "bride hidden early" you are referring to? Are you talking about Matthew 25?

@WorldSigh The literals of the allegories in the book of Revelation are in the Old Testament (and they are volumes) and some in the NT. Since we obviously are talking above each other's heads, let's just agree to disagree. Anyway we will know soon enough when the Lord returns, yes? Good day to you.

@eschatologyguy

Thank you, for an interesting discussion. It is always enlightening to hear the perspectives of others.
May God guide us both as we humbly seek to know Him better.